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  #1  
Old June 7th, 2009, 09:52 PM
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expanding playability on older figures

I hate the search option, it never gets me what I'm looking for.
Despite that...


With the reveal of the Gladiators, one group of figures has become a lot more playable.

While Atalga helps out all Kyrie, I'm more jazzed to see that Ullar got some Kyrie... only two generals left (with at least a couple Kyrie heroes too).

And I think how Skahen helped make all Vydar tricky figures a little more usuable, it was nice to have an ability to really get Dund up to the front without a bunch of Order Markers.




But my real question to y'all is, what figures or theme do you think need a booster unit/squad to make them playable?


I know some people gun for their favorite themes or figures, but I think (surely with the majority of people here) that the whole key to the game is balance, and some figures just don't have it.

It's a bit difficult for me to think what kind of new abilities would make which characters more playable without having power creep, but anything to keep some figures from collecting dust. Or maybe to change up how one uses existing characters that have fallen into specific niche.

I mean, I heard the idea of the skeleton calvary/ infantry that would bond with Cyprien, but that makes a monster unit way too good.

I've thought that a unit that could bond with a DW, 816 or the Zets would make that theme more playable, and not necessarilly make them too much more powerful... at least not compared to some other themes that are out (although bonding with a 'grenade' style attack would probably be a game-breaking ability).

Or Greeks and Romans... another warlord would help those fellows out (Spartans? really? maybe as a Unique squad)

Bonding with the Dragons is questionable, as we've seen how Mimring, the weakest of the bunch, is just fragile enough to get taken down pretty quickly. But Nilf, Charos, Zelrig and Braxas are powerhouses... I can't imagine having them more powerful.




Anybody have any other thoughts to this, to who needs some new unit lovin's?
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  #2  
Old June 7th, 2009, 10:00 PM
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Re: expanding playability on older figures

Groks... one more warlord atta do it, something to keep them around long enough to earn back their 130 points. I attempt to use them from game to game and at times they can but their consistancy doesn't make me count on them for games I'm serious about winning.
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Old June 7th, 2009, 10:24 PM
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Re: expanding playability on older figures

My thoughts on subjects you mentioned...

Quote:
I mean, I heard the idea of the skeleton calvary/ infantry that would bond with Cyprien, but that makes a monster unit way too good.
I've read about the idea about bonding between the Skeletons and Cyprien, and don't like the idea at all. Cyprien is too much of a powerhouse already, and gets a big bonus from Sonya, so I think he does not need bonding. I would much rather have Skeletons introduce a new form of bonding with a new form of hero.

Quote:
I've thought that a unit that could bond with a DW, 816 or the Zets would make that theme more playable, and not necessarilly make them too much more powerful... at least not compared to some other themes that are out (although bonding with a 'grenade' style attack would probably be a game-breaking ability).
New Utgar Soulborgs are needed, period. Some new Utgar borgs that have synergy with the existing borgs could help them out a lot. Most preferably with the DW's, because when they get better, the entire faction will get better.

Quote:
Or Greeks and Romans... another warlord would help those fellows out (Spartans? really? maybe as a Unique squad).
I think it's about time some Greek Spartans showed up in this game. A Spartan Warlord that gives bonuses to Soldiers would be great, IMO.

Quote:
Bonding with the Dragons is questionable, as we've seen how Mimring, the weakest of the bunch, is just fragile enough to get taken down pretty quickly. But Nilf, Charos, Zelrig and Braxas are powerhouses... I can't imagine having them more powerful.
The dragons, like Cyprien, don't need the bonding, because they are already tough. Mimring is a special case, being the weakest of the bunch, but he bonds with the Arrow Gruts, who are really weak themselves, so the balance there is noticable. The dragons are already a dominant force in this game, so they are all set.

The figures from the top of my head that need some help, would be the Groks. I would like a Warlord that gives some defense to Marro figures that are melee. Come on, the last Warlord the Marro got was in Wave 2, and filling out the Marro hierarchy would be nice.

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Old June 7th, 2009, 10:35 PM
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Re: expanding playability on older figures

Quote:
Originally Posted by SymphonyScaper View Post
The figures from the top of my head that need some help, would be the Groks. I would like a Warlord that gives some defense to Marro figures that are melee. Come on, the last Warlord the Marro got was in Wave 2, and filling out the Marro hierarchy would be nice.
Exactly, or possibly a warlord meant only for the grok riders because drones don't need too much help and an additional defence dice would practically make them 50 point KoW. I could see a high move hero that boosted groks within like a 3 or 4 space range with defence or like a death defy ability. Also a boost to marro hunters would be cool because thats drudge (which need some dusting off) and groks only.

Also Mimring got boosted a bit with Ornak's Red Flag of Fury.

Thinking about it more the Einar Kyrie, even with a speed boost, all need some help. I think that a male Einar Kyrie hero could make EK and the EI more playable if he helped them enough (still not very possible in a 500 point army). A male Einar Kyrie (or any Vydar or aquilla kyrie) would be sweet.
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  #5  
Old June 7th, 2009, 10:45 PM
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Re: expanding playability on older figures

Give the DW's (And the Warden) bonding with the Deathstalkers, Deathreavers, and Zettians. That would make them at least playable.

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Old June 7th, 2009, 10:56 PM
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Re: expanding playability on older figures

My only thought to that is you would be asking for a change in existing figures... slim to no chance of that happening.

Something official and tournament worthy was what I had in mind.

One can house-rule and custom figure to the ends of the Earth... but that won't help the general playability.
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Old June 7th, 2009, 11:10 PM
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Re: expanding playability on older figures

Quote:
Originally Posted by MalignantT View Post
My only thought to that is you would be asking for a change in existing figures... slim to no chance of that happening.

Something official and tournament worthy was what I had in mind.

One can house-rule and custom figure to the ends of the Earth... but that won't help the general playability.
Fine then . A Kato/Uglinesh figure for Utgar Soulborgs that allows you to use one Utgar Soulborg hero, and one Utgar Soulborg squad in one turn. Make it like 150 points, and give it the ability to survive for one extra turn after it takes enough wounds to die.

By helping out the playability of the Warden, you also boost the playability of the Obsidian Guards a little.

While we're on the topic of the Obsidians, they should bond with Brunak. I'm sure officially fixing ONE card isn't that big of a deal. Just put a printout in the next FAQ, or something.

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Last edited by ParaGoomba Slayer; June 7th, 2009 at 11:19 PM.
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  #8  
Old June 7th, 2009, 11:13 PM
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Re: expanding playability on older figures

1. I still want a squad of gladiators with range like javelin throwers and a gladiator hero with range.

2. Vydar archers of some sort.

I don't care about choosing my army based on strategy. I choose an army based on coolness and personal appeal... even if it means that my units will die trying. Hail to the glory of HeroScape and bravery.
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  #9  
Old June 7th, 2009, 11:14 PM
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Re: expanding playability on older figures

There are so many figures out there that could get a boost, I am sure they will be boosting them for waves to come. There are a few that stand out to me.

I see allot of posts about Spartans. I just figure Parminio and the sacred band fill that role. They may not be like the ones from the movie 300, but I do not see them making an actual "Spartan" squad.
If they did do it, I picture they would just be like the gladiators, a bunch of close ranged powerhouses.

I would like to see an undead lord who gives a movement bonus to zombies. I was so excited about the zombies when the Dawn of Darkness Wave came out, but they do not have the staying power I hoped for. An extra defense or something.

I also want some unit that boosts the deathwalkers value. I always pictured them conceptually as some of the most feared units in Utgars army.
I picture a soulborg with a defensive forcefield ability like Raelin who boosts only Utgar Soulborgs. A couple more defense die on DW9000 could make him the threat his figure deserves to be.

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  #10  
Old June 7th, 2009, 11:16 PM
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Re: expanding playability on older figures

I believe that most of these figures don't need new bonding. Sure, I could go for the Utgar SBs to have some bonding. I could go for The imperium being bondable. But what I think is that most figures created for the Heroscape fighting already have what they need. The Utgarian Soulborgs are powerhouses in themselves. The theory of bonding with deathreavers! Do you truly want to take the fun out of the game? What opponent wants x20 deathreavers harrying his troops because they have some guy that can bond with them? I think this would overpower the reavers. The DWs don't need bonding, they have their insane specials and the huge defense. I think the DWs have amazing playability that people might take for granted. If we give DW7k the ability to bond, he walks up, with supression fire on his side, and blows up everything around him! That would be insanely powerful. Sure Utgar may not have the greatest synergy in his army to hisself, but that is the beauty of his army. You have to swarm to Utterly win with it. A new marro warlord may be needed, though. The EI! If we gave the EI bonding, hey in two turns, height advantage, in 3, some poor fool has to bum rush these guys on a hill, and not only do they have a double attack, they have another figure with them that does god knows what damage! I think this would make them seriously too powerful! A lot of tournament armies would become generic also. My two cents.

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  #11  
Old June 7th, 2009, 11:39 PM
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Re: expanding playability on older figures

yeah, I didn't mean this to be another thread of wish-listed figures, as much as trying to figures out which heroes/themes need a boost to make them competitive.

I also worry about some figures becoming stuck in a niche... where they only get used with in certain builds. It's good for themes to have synergy within themselves to be workable, but I think trans-theme and trans-army synergies make very interesting builds.
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Old June 8th, 2009, 12:19 AM
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Re: expanding playability on older figures

Figures that need something...
Dund- a bonus, bonding, something.
Grok Riders- another Warlord.
Wolves of Badru- another darklord to bond with.
Elf Wizards- A ninth wizard with awesome synergized.
Hatamoto Taro and Kato Katsuro- Anything will help Taro, perhaps a common Saurai squad could help both.
Ninjas- Perhaps a Sensei hero that will have a synergy with many units, but only one per game like the MacDirks.

That would square things out for me.
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