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  #97  
Old October 13th, 2021, 03:12 PM
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Re: 2021 C3V Playtest Tournament - Round 3 until 10/18

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knight of Scape View Post
550 Points
Battlefield 23 (Dagmar, Holdir, Treasure Glyph x2 [Bracers of Teleportation, Scarab of Invulnerability])

Knight of Scape's Army: Janos, C'Rik, Rygarn, Etiana, Wastewalker Gage, Byrikon the Hiveless, Isamu, Otonashi

shiftrex's - Army: Crypt Guardian x4 , Drow Chainfighter x2, Marro Warriors, Kalagrith, Eldgrim, Marcu Eldgrim

Which units survived?
Shiftrex resigned at Janos, C'Rik (1 wound), Etiana, Byrikon (2 wounds), Rygarn, Isamu, and Otonashi vs. 1 crypt guardian, Marcu, and Eldgrim (1 wound).

General Battle Report/Flow of game (be as detailed or general as you like)
This was another dominant win for the mercenary explorers against a dragon army. As usual, I was my OMs as 1 on Janos, 2,X on Byrikon, 3 on Etiana for the whole game. Rygarn stayed at the front of the startzone all game, while Janos was careful to stay within 6 spaces of him.

Shiftrex led out with Kalagrith, and grabbed both treasure glyphs, but my heroes were able to spread out enough to deny any good scorched earth attacks, and they quickly took down half of Kalagrith's life, leading Shiftrex to retreat her back to the startzone with her bracers of teleportation.

The crypt guardians came out next, while the mercenary heroes more or less held their ground and gunned them down. Between Janos's and Gage's special attacks, Tough wasn't too much of an issue. The Marro Warriors were the third round of assault, but C'rik rushed them down while Janos and Etiana continued to shoot, taking down the warriors fairly quickly.

How useful were playtesting units' powers and how often did they come into play?

Janos: Expedition was again the MVP. Tracking Fire was also extremely useful in this game, since it let Janos double attack a crypt guardian while ignoring tough. Between damage to Kalagrith and to the guardians, Janos more than earned his points back just with his own attacks, besides the benefits of Expedition.

C'Rik: Holographic Projector activated 1/3 times, allowing C'Rik to make a useful retreat to high ground. Quaarn assault was very useful for letting the merc army get a ton of attacks in one turn. Phantom walk didn't really come into play this game.

Byrikon: Hive-Mind integration allowed me to win 1 initiative that I otherwise would have lost (and it would have been enough to swing the init even with a +3 boost). As I've observed before, putting 1 OM on Janos and 2 on Byrikon is almost free for this army, so Byrikon's init bonus is a nice plus that you can get with no extra thought.

Etiana: Support fire was useful for taking turns with Gage and Byrikon on the turns when I couldn't Expedition. The restriction to not move and only attack enemies adjacent to my heroes was not a big deal since Shiftrex's army had a bunch of heroes, and I already wanted to engage them with C'Rik and Gage, so unlike in some previous games, I was able to keep Etiana parked on height near my startzone and just snipe at people. Acrobatic did nothing this game. I don't think that Etiana was ever attacked.

Any additional comments (theme, balance, fun factor with and against)?

I continue to enjoy playing the Mercenary Explorers. The flexibility that Janos provides allows for a lot of interesting decisions, and I find myself using different hero combos from turn to turn depending on the board state. I also enjoy the element of planning ahead to ensure useful support fire turns for Etiana (which was easier to do this game than it was in the previous rounds). I have noticed that the large number of interactions can often make the army confusing for other people to play against, but I think that part of that is an inevitable effect of having an army with 5 unreleased units in it.

I do agree with the general sentiment that the power level of the army is probably a bit too high, though. In particular, I feel like Janos himself is too strong offensively. One interesting aspect of Expedition compared to other commander powers, like Ulglinesh, Kato, or Kurrok, is that Janos himself has to be one of the three heroes you take a turn with. As things stand, this is barely a restriction, since the fact that Janos gets a double special attack at range makes him someone you'd almost always want to take a turn with anyway. The amount of firepower that Janos contributes on his own also means that trying to snipe him early feels like the main hope that a lot of opponents have against the mercenaries (something that's not easy to do with Janos's general bulk and C'Rik's holographic projector).

Rather than making Janos easier to kill (which I feel would lead to swingy games whose outcome depends on how effective a few crucial attacks on Janos are), I'd rather nerf his offense so that taking out the other mercs one by one becomes a more effective way to weaken the army (similar to elf wizards, where many of their powers depend on having lots of elf wizards around, so targeting Uglinesh isn't necessary to wear down the army).

My inclination would be to just remove Janos's special attack. Expedition is already a game-changing power that defines the army, and the army is already fairly complicated, so I think Janos would be fine with just one power. He doesn't need to the special to incentivize you to take turns with him, since he's guaranteed a turn every expedition anyway, and he'll still be able to do something useful with his normal ranged attack.

Also, the Mercenaries already have access to other special attackers in Gage and Bambina, so I don't feel like removing Janos's special would kill the army's potential against rats and such.
Nothing further to add in the play by play breakdown.

My impression of the explorer/mercenary army is that it is quite strong, the offensive power it has is complimented by the fact that it is a hero based army so it doesn't suffer from development or tempo losses in the same way that a squad based army would. I found it a bit overwhelming to play against because they can deal so much damage.

That combined with they fact that they are a ranged army makes them pretty oppressive to play against, especially considering that I used Kalagrath who is not a traditional dragon. I assume that if I used something like Nilfheim or Quahon then I wouldn't be as hard pressed in a ranged shoot out. I'll go over each hero individually:

Byrikon: Some shenanigans occur here that gets the initiative roll quite high, I agree with the nerf to +1 instead of +2 per OM on the hive mind maker holder. In the +2 version, I generally roll poorly for initiative as it is (I've got it charted, no johns) so it was quite oppressive and made it so that if I ever wanted initiative I had to rely on a very poor roll from the opponent or holding Dagmar. The nerf should bring this guy in line where he would be less oppressive to play against.

Rapid response seems like a fine clean up power, haven't seen it in action yet.

Janos: Too much and too many things going on. I agree with the life total nerf and the SA nerf that is going into effect. I think those changes would make him less oppressive. Pre-nerf perspective, as a 6 life hero there is just no punishment for him playing aggressively as he will likely have the initiative and gun down more than a few targets with his psuedo squad.

The special attack will feel better after the adjustment, gives him a reason to use his normal attack once in a while as well after the life drop.

Expedition is worded strangely to enable the rygarn play, I don't see a reason for this at all. Why isn't he just worded like Ornak? OM 1 reveal will give you bonding with two heroes and no Rygarn shenanigans. Functioning as a squad essentially for 2/3 turns with additional flexibility options makes me wonder why the complication instead of just giving him full bonding? I feel like this is an example of design trying to say "if you stand on your head you get a bonus," and in this case it is including rygarn in your build. Either he should have 1 bond per round with am OM 1 reveal or an X marker reveal, or just have regular bonding. No extra theme is imparted here and its just a weird mechanical function every turn that reminds me of Yugioh's wasted movement.

Etania:

No issues with this hero. I like that support fire gives you a reason to put order markers on someone other than Janos in this army. The stats are nice and Acrobatic is fine. From a futuristic unit I would have liked to see the theme of 1 shield blocking specials so she is showing that she is good against the futuristic weapons of her own world, or using tech to deal with magic, but dealing with normal attacks is completely acceptable and strong.

C'rik:

I agree with the nerfs here. Holographic projector on 15 just "seems" to make the army too durable but I agree that this army should have it to protect the explorers that can go down more easily. Miniature fits having this power.

Quaarn assault was a bit weird, it gives the group access to a ton of attacks if you set it up correctly which is fine but I'm not able to clearly identify the army as a glass canon or a durable army pre-changes. Pre-changes it just does it all really well, only settling down a bit on turn 3 with its offensive potential. What's the theme of Quaarn only being able to smack someone twice if he has 4 arms and we are giving him Quad-attack in the first place. I'd rather just see him with plain whirlwind attack here... or even just 4 attacks without the ability to double attack something, the choice to attack a figure more than once isn't really meaningful because it is just good. It will always be double attack against a figure that I want dead, and if it just happens that I killed my target on the first go then I'll move my attack to another figure.

I get that the power is tied to his species but without any kind of bio or explanation I don't get 'why' he functions this way. I would need additional information to justify why he does this in my mind. Theme isn't coming across, I don't have exposure to any alien or other multi-armed entity that would function this way given choice.

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  #98  
Old October 14th, 2021, 12:19 AM
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Re: 2021 C3V Playtest Tournament - Round 4 until 11/1

Finally getting off my lazy butt to report my game.

Armies were:
Blue Trails: Acolytes of Vorganund x3, Master Caylus, Skull Demon, Cathar Spearmen x2, Count Raymond, Marcu Esenwein
Sir H: Children of the Dark Star x4, Gräbermund, Raelin (RotV), Swaysil, Marcu Esenwein

The map had Holdir and Dagmar. Neither was particularly useful or game-changing to maintain so I figured a more central position would probably be a better bet for general positioning. Looking at the map though, treasure glyphs actually seems like a really good possibility. With low defense heroes like Grabby and Swaysil I felt like I was actually going to get some value if I could rush out to get the treasures. What's more, I realized that Swaysil was able to grab one in 1 move from the SZ AND (depending on the position of enemy placement) take the 2nd treasure in the next turn. I also realized that having a full melee Army, Blue Trails would have to come to me if I dictated the game early with Swaysil. So I decided to lean into her fast and furious movement/range and drop all OM's on her for the first 2 full rounds (and I think some of the 3rd round). That actually ended up playing really well into my favor as she commanded the battlefield. She was able to pick up the Talisman of Defense on turn 1 (literally the best glyph she could have gotten) and I then proceeded to kite her around the board sniping Acolytes 1 by 1 as they tried to develop and coral her. It didn't really work as her defense was rolling quite good with the t-glyph (and usually height) and I was even able to disengage 2 times without taking wounds. At one point, I was engaged by 2 Acolytes and a Skull Demon on an Init Switch, but then proceeded to disengage (after taking no wounds from attacks) because I wanted Swaysil back in Raelin's aura and not to die where the Skull Demon could grab the glyph. so I figured if she was going to die it was going to be back near the SZ, in Raelin's aura and close enough for Grabby to pick up her glyph. All said and done, Swaysil was able to pick off 6 out of the 9 Acolytes and only take 3 wounds. I counted that as a big win on my end. But, now with her a bit out of commission, I needed to switch over to Children. Unfortunately, I grossly misjudged the matchup by not realizing Children didn't effect Caylus, the Skull Demon or the Acolytes...so the developed Skull Demon and Caylus really made it insane to get anything done. What's more, Blue Trails never failed to lose an initiative (I think maybe near the end he did 1) and he religiously put om's on Caylus OM1 in order to nerf Grabby each round...which I didn't realize until it was too late, REALLY kills GRABBY. For a Dragon who can fly and still has a mean attack or a Robot who can shoot from far away, Caylus doesn't do too much...but Grabby loses literally everything he can do when Enfeebled. This made it extremely difficult to develop a strong offensive with Caylus and the Skull Demon in my face and with Grabby nerfed each round (I just started loading up the Children) and the Children trying to pull their weight. That said, the Children actually kept me in it for quite a while. I figured my win condition was having them kill as many Cathar as possible and kill Caylus and then I should be able to trade Grabby against the Skull Demon, a few cathar and Ramond. Unfortunately none of those happened. While children traded pretty decently against Cathar and got them down to just 3 before they all died, it wasn't quite enough. Marcu came in for me and did quite a bit getting a couple big attacks and then locking up Caylus and the skull demon in engagements for a solid round+. Unfortunately, when I was looking for a big attack, I made the mistake of showing my hand by not placing an X on Grabby and so when Marcu got too close to Caylus, Caylus enfeebled Marcu, leaving him with a measly attack. The endgame a full life Grabby, 1 life Swaysil vs 1 life Caylus, Full Skull, Full Raymond and 3 Cathar. I actually still liked my odds because if I could finish off Caylus, I felt Grabby with full life could trade against the skull demon fairly well, Raymond could get swallowed and 3 cathar could get swallowed as well. But, 3 Cathar are still Cathar and Blue Trails baited me into going for Caylus (Because I couldn't not, I HAD to make sure he died otherwise Grabby does nothing). So instead of OM1 on Caylus he went Skull demon to get a big attack down with engagement and then 2 and 3 on Cathar. Grabby did virtually nothing and took a lot of damage very quickly before eating dirt. It was rather a sad ending for him. In hindsight I maybe should have killed Swaysil with Grabby just to make sure I can get him the Def +1, but I didn't like not having a ranged option in the endgame and couldn't bring myself to making that play.

Survived: Marcu (3L), Raymond (Full)

Performance:
Swallow 0/0
SA 4/7
Clamber - used whenever he moved

Damage
1w Caylus
1w Skull (normal)
3w Skull (SA) - 1W was used to negate using SoI t-glyph


Thoughts on Grabby:
To be honest, it was going to be a tough endgame against that many figures, but with them all wounded, and multiple OM's to place (and potentially lose), I felt like Grabby was going to shine with his high life, mobility and terrifying swallow potential and SA's. He bit the dust. Me saying his weak just because he lost seems a bit unfair, but I truly believe a 160 hero with that terrifying potential in and endgame state like that is ideal and quite frankly should perform really well. Maybe I misplayed it? not sure, but I really felt like he would shine in that board state. I'm inclined to think a Def of 4 might be warranted, but that's hard to say considering how big of a move 3 --> 4 def is to a figures' balance...so I'm not exactly sure.

Thoughts on Caylus:
This was the first game I've ever seen Caylus be 1) Relevant and 2) Terrifying. Caylus nerfed my turns/rounds multiple times by well placed OM's and his 5 attack 6 from height when next to the Skull Demon. It was a good combo pairing the two and tanking with the skull demon then smashing with Caylus. That said, 4 attack seems high for this support figure. I'm not convinced by the nature of the model OR the design that his "Brother" or "Father" cleric can smack as hard as Grabby (a huge alien demon horror thing). Other suggestions have said a ranged attack feels more in line here. I actually think I like a short range of 4-5 for Caylus and a reduction of his attack to 3. Attack of 3 seems well suited for the design and mini and a short ranged attack will help his usefulness without feeling overpowered...but it was just hard to swallow that this guy could smack me for 4 base attack.
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  #99  
Old October 14th, 2021, 11:52 PM
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Other Thoughts

Very much in favor of the change to Ataraxis. The Terror field can be brutal especially with figures that like disengaging. It stopping dragons though is a bit hard to believe and most of the large/huge really need to have the option to run away. This can make it hard to get to her if you just have melee figures. I like this figure a lot still.

Kala is also very good. You can't really play around the special. You just hope you don't get nuked by it. In the mid-end game 7 move flying is so good. I know some people have suggested she have disengage but I am firmly against it as she will be an absolute terror if she doesn't have to think about disengaging to burninate the countryside.


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  #100  
Old October 15th, 2021, 01:06 AM
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Re: 2021 C3V Playtest Tournament - Round 4 until 11/1

Sir Heroscape already explained our game well, so I am just going to tack on my commentary on the units involved.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
Finally getting off my lazy butt to report my game.

Armies were:
Blue Trails: Acolytes of Vorganund x3, Master Caylus, Skull Demon, Cathar Spearmen x2, Count Raymond, Marcu Esenwein
Sir H: Children of the Dark Star x4, Gräbermund, Raelin (RotV), Swaysil, Marcu Esenwein

The map had Holdir and Dagmar. Neither was particularly useful or game-changing to maintain so I figured a more central position would probably be a better bet for general positioning. Looking at the map though, treasure glyphs actually seems like a really good possibility. With low defense heroes like Grabby and Swaysil I felt like I was actually going to get some value if I could rush out to get the treasures. What's more, I realized that Swaysil was able to grab one in 1 move from the SZ AND (depending on the position of enemy placement) take the 2nd treasure in the next turn. I also realized that having a full melee Army, Blue Trails would have to come to me if I dictated the game early with Swaysil. So I decided to lean into her fast and furious movement/range and drop all OM's on her for the first 2 full rounds (and I think some of the 3rd round). That actually ended up playing really well into my favor as she commanded the battlefield. She was able to pick up the Talisman of Defense on turn 1 (literally the best glyph she could have gotten) and I then proceeded to kite her around the board sniping Acolytes 1 by 1 as they tried to develop and coral her. It didn't really work as her defense was rolling quite good with the t-glyph (and usually height) and I was even able to disengage 2 times without taking wounds. At one point, I was engaged by 2 Acolytes and a Skull Demon on an Init Switch, but then proceeded to disengage (after taking no wounds from attacks) because I wanted Swaysil back in Raelin's aura and not to die where the Skull Demon could grab the glyph. so I figured if she was going to die it was going to be back near the SZ, in Raelin's aura and close enough for Grabby to pick up her glyph. All said and done, Swaysil was able to pick off 6 out of the 9 Acolytes and only take 3 wounds. I counted that as a big win on my end. But, now with her a bit out of commission, I needed to switch over to Children. Unfortunately, I grossly misjudged the matchup by not realizing Children didn't effect Caylus, the Skull Demon or the Acolytes...so the developed Skull Demon and Caylus really made it insane to get anything done. What's more, Blue Trails never failed to lose an initiative (I think maybe near the end he did 1) and he religiously put om's on Caylus OM1 in order to nerf Grabby each round...which I didn't realize until it was too late, REALLY kills GRABBY. For a Dragon who can fly and still has a mean attack or a Robot who can shoot from far away, Caylus doesn't do too much...but Grabby loses literally everything he can do when Enfeebled. This made it extremely difficult to develop a strong offensive with Caylus and the Skull Demon in my face and with Grabby nerfed each round (I just started loading up the Children) and the Children trying to pull their weight. That said, the Children actually kept me in it for quite a while. I figured my win condition was having them kill as many Cathar as possible and kill Caylus and then I should be able to trade Grabby against the Skull Demon, a few cathar and Ramond. Unfortunately none of those happened. While children traded pretty decently against Cathar and got them down to just 3 before they all died, it wasn't quite enough. Marcu came in for me and did quite a bit getting a couple big attacks and then locking up Caylus and the skull demon in engagements for a solid round+. Unfortunately, when I was looking for a big attack, I made the mistake of showing my hand by not placing an X on Grabby and so when Marcu got too close to Caylus, Caylus enfeebled Marcu, leaving him with a measly attack. The endgame a full life Grabby, 1 life Swaysil vs 1 life Caylus, Full Skull, Full Raymond and 3 Cathar. I actually still liked my odds because if I could finish off Caylus, I felt Grabby with full life could trade against the skull demon fairly well, Raymond could get swallowed and 3 cathar could get swallowed as well. But, 3 Cathar are still Cathar and Blue Trails baited me into going for Caylus (Because I couldn't not, I HAD to make sure he died otherwise Grabby does nothing). So instead of OM1 on Caylus he went Skull demon to get a big attack down with engagement and then 2 and 3 on Cathar. Grabby did virtually nothing and took a lot of damage very quickly before eating dirt. It was rather a sad ending for him. In hindsight I maybe should have killed Swaysil with Grabby just to make sure I can get him the Def +1, but I didn't like not having a ranged option in the endgame and couldn't bring myself to making that play.

Survived: Marcu (3L), Raymond (Full)

Performance:
Swallow 0/0
SA 4/7
Clamber - used whenever he moved

Damage
1w Caylus
1w Skull (normal)
3w Skull (SA) - 1W was used to negate using SoI t-glyph


Thoughts on Grabby:
To be honest, it was going to be a tough endgame against that many figures, but with them all wounded, and multiple OM's to place (and potentially lose), I felt like Grabby was going to shine with his high life, mobility and terrifying swallow potential and SA's. He bit the dust. Me saying his weak just because he lost seems a bit unfair, but I truly believe a 160 hero with that terrifying potential in and endgame state like that is ideal and quite frankly should perform really well. Maybe I misplayed it? not sure, but I really felt like he would shine in that board state. I'm inclined to think a Def of 4 might be warranted, but that's hard to say considering how big of a move 3 --> 4 def is to a figures' balance...so I'm not exactly sure.

Thoughts on Caylus:
This was the first game I've ever seen Caylus be 1) Relevant and 2) Terrifying. Caylus nerfed my turns/rounds multiple times by well placed OM's and his 5 attack 6 from height when next to the Skull Demon. It was a good combo pairing the two and tanking with the skull demon then smashing with Caylus. That said, 4 attack seems high for this support figure. I'm not convinced by the nature of the model OR the design that his "Brother" or "Father" cleric can smack as hard as Grabby (a huge alien demon horror thing). Other suggestions have said a ranged attack feels more in line here. I actually think I like a short range of 4-5 for Caylus and a reduction of his attack to 3. Attack of 3 seems well suited for the design and mini and a short ranged attack will help his usefulness without feeling overpowered...but it was just hard to swallow that this guy could smack me for 4 base attack.
How useful were playtesting units' powers and how often did they come into play?

Master Caylus:
Rod of Enfeeblement: used thrice on Grabemund and once on Marcu; combination with adjacent figures and obstacles denied some attack opportunities to Grabermund; neutered Marcu for an entire round.
Brutal Taskmaster: used on the first and third rounds; affected eight Acolyte moves; helped the Acolytes maneuver uneven terrain in the early game and chase Swaysil; boosted a few Acolytes' Attack values.
Normal Attack: used 4 times; wounded Raelin and Marcu and struck a Child.


Any additional comments (theme, balance, fun factor with and against)?

Master Caylus:
Spoiler Alert!



Outsiders:
Spoiler Alert!
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  #101  
Old October 15th, 2021, 02:47 AM
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Re: 2021 C3V Playtest Tournament - Round 4 until 11/1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
Thoughts on Grabby:
To be honest, it was going to be a tough endgame against that many figures, but with them all wounded, and multiple OM's to place (and potentially lose), I felt like Grabby was going to shine with his high life, mobility and terrifying swallow potential and SA's. He bit the dust. Me saying his weak just because he lost seems a bit unfair, but I truly believe a 160 hero with that terrifying potential in and endgame state like that is ideal and quite frankly should perform really well. Maybe I misplayed it? not sure, but I really felt like he would shine in that board state. I'm inclined to think a Def of 4 might be warranted, but that's hard to say considering how big of a move 3 --> 4 def is to a figures' balance...so I'm not exactly sure.
Spoiler Alert!



If I was going to comment on this (and I guess I am), and I just went through your game and watched it, I think you lost this by deciding to go head to head Grabermund vs. Skull Demon instead of taking out the Cathars. Grabermund has a 70% chance of taking out a single cathar with his 4 attacks and that doesn't take into account devour so you're probably looking at 85+%. At the time there were only 2 Cathar left. By going at the Skull Demon not only did you allow the Skull Demon (much harder to kill than a single Cathar) good punches against the Outsider, it allowed the 2 Cathar to move against you (and one took height). You would never have given up height if you went at the Cathar when you did your disengage instead of retreating.

In the image in the spoiler you took Grave on OM2 and retreated to the east (taking his 3rd wound from disengage) I think the play would have been to attack the Cathar on the level 3 height. 85%+ chance of kill and Skull Demon would have to take a triple disengage to get an even attack on you (assuming you did get the Cathar kill). So I assume BT doesn't triple disengage and opts for an attack on Marcu like he did in reality or the Dark Star.

From there on your OM3 you could wrap around the north side of the walls to kill the last Cathar or you could push into the startzone and get to Count Raymond (or Marcu) and start getting quad attacks with swallow attempts on him when he doesn't have an OM. That's the other part of retreating that neutered Grabermund's strengths. You locked him into one battle instead of getting to battle selection and making BT's order markers a nightmare.

In Summary the 160 point total is built around the damage he can do quickly to small/medium heroes and squaddies, but it looks like the bulk of his attacking and what tied him up was going head on with a Large hero.
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  #102  
Old October 15th, 2021, 03:41 AM
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Re: 2021 C3V Playtest Tournament - Round 4 until 11/1

you make a fair point there. I think at that stage of the game, recognizing the Skull Demon was locked up momentarily and that I could run around a bit, could have been a good move. That said, I was also quite concerned about a world where I leave Swaysil to die (while I run around) and the skull demon gets the Talisman of Def. I didn't want an endgame with that, and was actually hoping a Cathar would finish her off so I could pick up the glyph. In hindsight, I was probably too worried about that unlikely scenario (a lot of things have to go right for that to happen) and should have made that play you mentioned.
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  #103  
Old October 16th, 2021, 01:07 PM
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Re: 2021 C3V Playtest Tournament - Round 4 until 11/1

Just finished the game

Muskie: Nhah Scirh Cultistsx4, Greenscale Warriors x1, Kalagrith
mtl1998 : Acolytes of Vorganund x4, Caylus, Corvor, Kaemon Awa

Round 1: Mtl1998 moved Caylus and then the Acolytes while I positioned Cultists for two rounds. He then summoned Covor and took out three Cultists with powered Acolytes and Covor while I countered with taking out an Acolyte and failing on an attack on Covor.

Round 2: I won Init and attacked with cultists, taking out another Acolyte and putting three wounds on Covor. Mtl took out a cultist, missed three corruptions, and then killed another cultist with Covor. Turn two had me focus on Covor and missing, covor taking a leaving engagement, missing on two corruptions and killing a cultist. we exchanged 2 cultists for two Acolytes in turn 3 (mtl finaly got a corruption).

Round 3: mtl got the init switch and activated Caylus to power the Acolytes and got a kill, but exposed him. I moved in and got a luck 3-3 with him whiffing on defense, and missing on Covor, who was in a good position. I needed to keep engaging so he wouldn't move, even though I was swinging up. In turn 2 I lost two more cultists, so took the turn with positioning and no attacks. turn 3, I lost a cultist and mtl lost two acolytes and another wound on Covor.

round 4: Another init switch and I thought I could finish off Covor. Two attacks on the one life Demon missed, but I took out 2 acolytes. Mtl went 0-3 on Corruption again, but killed one cultist with the attack. Turn 2 I missed one on Covor, one an an Acolyte and one on Kaemon (knowing he was about to enter the game) and was killed on counterstrike. Another cultist goes down to Kaemon's bow and he is now in good position with full health. Now the weird dice really take hold. I bring up Kalagrith and the greenies in turn three to finish off Covor (taking up lots of space in the middle of the board), but roll 0-4 on my attack. mtl counters with a heighted attack on an exposed Kaligrith, getting 3-5 but I block with 3-3.

I have a full life Kalagrith with three Green Scales and two Cultists. Mtl1998 has full life Kaemon (set up on height 4 lava), 1 Acolyte and a 1 life Caylus.

round 5: I roll a 5 for init, but mtl rolls a 4. I fly over Covor and Caylus and land so I can get to Kaemon and kill the last Acolyte with a Greenie. I roll 3-4, to kill covor, but mtl gets a 3-3 defensive roll to save Caylus and clog up the board. I then go 0-3 on the greenie attack on Caylus (Caylus lives!). Mtl moves and attacks with his last acolyte (if he had won itit, Covor would have had a huge attack on Kalagrith) and misses. In turn 2, I miss Caylus with an attack of 5, but finally finish him and the Acolyte off with my Greenies. Kaemon kills a greenie and puts a quick 2 wounds on Kalagrith (four lives left). For turn three, I only have an OM on Kalagrith, so do a Kaemon fly over and land on a treasure glyph to get teleportation. thinking I would get a wound on Kaemon, I roll 0-4. Kaemon finishes off the round with putting 3 more wounds on Kalagrith and taking a lava wound.

Muskie: 1 life Kalagrith, 2 greenies and 2 cultists
mtl1998: 3 life Kaemon

Round 6: Mtl wins init and decides to finish off Kalagrith with two easy quick releases, and goes 0-4 and 0-4 (our combined last 3 attacks have gone 0-12, a 0.002% chance of hapening). I do another flyover (doing two damage) and land out of quick release range. I then tie up Kaemon with a greenie. He rotates to get out of range of my 2nd Greenie and kills the one adjacent. I go all or nothing and fly in. I roll 4-5 to finish off the game.

Comments on the play test Heroes

Kalagrith - this is my first time playing her. I really like the dynamic, but to use her early has a high chance of killing your own and the 3 defense for end game is dicey (I should have died but got very lucky). I don't think the stats should change, but maybe 10 points less? I scorched earth 3 times, killing a one life Covor and putting two wounds on Kaemon. I could not risk it earlier because squads can quickly kill her after one attack (then tie her up to finish her off). I see her as an endgame dragon or against specialty armies like mezzo demons. I would also consider single base like Moltenclaw. for the extra 10 points, I would take Moltenclaw. The fact that Kalagrith must land within range of its prey and cannot land on height very often (double base really hinders that) makes her a touch too expensive. Also, if you are protecting her, you probably will have to fly over your screen, risking their lives as well. A fun Dragon that is very different, but I think needs some very minor tweaking.

Caylus - The extra movement and attack die makes him a big help to the Acolytes ( really makes them a playable army). With the life lowered by 1, he is easier to take out since he has to step out and engage unless you want to lose a round of attack. I would like to see a short range instead of range 1. I never saw enfeeblement, so that might completely change my mind. Just was not part of our game. Maybe move some acolytes without them attacking (I think we have some characters that do that).

I look forward to both of these as part of our official game! I offer minor tweak thought, but overall great work with some cool ideas!

What GenCon taught me was to assume only one skull on three dice!
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  #104  
Old October 17th, 2021, 01:01 AM
mtl1998 mtl1998 is offline
 
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Re: 2021 C3V Playtest Tournament - Round 4 until 11/1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskie View Post
Just finished the game

Muskie: Nhah Scirh Cultistsx4, Greenscale Warriors x1, Kalagrith
mtl1998 : Acolytes of Vorganund x4, Caylus, Corvor, Kaemon Awa

Spoiler Alert!


Comments on the play test Heroes

Kalagrith - this is my first time playing her. I really like the dynamic, but to use her early has a high chance of killing your own and the 3 defense for end game is dicey (I should have died but got very lucky). I don't think the stats should change, but maybe 10 points less? I scorched earth 3 times, killing a one life Covor and putting two wounds on Kaemon. I could not risk it earlier because squads can quickly kill her after one attack (then tie her up to finish her off). I see her as an endgame dragon or against specialty armies like mezzo demons. I would also consider single base like Moltenclaw. for the extra 10 points, I would take Moltenclaw. The fact that Kalagrith must land within range of its prey and cannot land on height very often (double base really hinders that) makes her a touch too expensive. Also, if you are protecting her, you probably will have to fly over your screen, risking their lives as well. A fun Dragon that is very different, but I think needs some very minor tweaking.
It's interesting to me that Muskie sees Kalagrith as and endgame figure. I brought a Kalagrith army with several more greenscales and did not think to save them until the endgame. I played my army once and had it played against me once. Both times I was underwhelmed by Kalagrith. I think Muskie played it better than I did, or maybe the army Muskie brought leads to a play style that saves Kalagrith for the endgame. I have no problem with any of the stats or powers. 7 life is a lot but not automatically bad in my opinion. I think Kalagrith definitely looks better when saved for the end of the game.
Quote:
Caylus - The extra movement and attack die makes him a big help to the Acolytes ( really makes them a playable army). With the life lowered by 1, he is easier to take out since he has to step out and engage unless you want to lose a round of attack. I would like to see a short range instead of range 1. I never saw enfeeblement, so that might completely change my mind. Just was not part of our game. Maybe move some acolytes without them attacking (I think we have some characters that do that).
I really love the design of Caylus. Round 2 I had to choose between putting OM 1 on him in order to make the last two OMs of acolytes more powerful or putting all 3 on acolytes and start the round by attacking with 3 attack acolytes. This was a fun and strategic decision I had to make. I think 4 life is fine. Most of the time he'll be behind the squads he's granting a movement bonus to. Like Muskie said, there was no real chance at using enfeeblement so Caylus might have been less valuable this game, but still, he was good and helped my army out a lot at key moments. If people are thinking Caylus is too powerful, I could see his movement bonus being brought down to +1 instead of +2. But I think he's fine as is.
Quote:
I look forward to both of these as part of our official game! I offer minor tweak thought, but overall great work with some cool ideas!
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  #105  
Old October 17th, 2021, 01:14 AM
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Re: 2021 C3V Playtest Tournament - Round 4 until 11/1

Finally got around to writing up my thoughts based on my Round 3 Game.

Map: Custom

Army 1: Janos, Bambina, Maekor, Etiana, C'Rik, Matlis
Army 2: Mohicans x5, Nessing, Bol, Kolbjorn

Which units survived? 4 life Nessing, Bol, and 5 Mohicans

Game overview (from Kevin’s perspective)
Spoiler Alert!


How useful were playtesting units' powers and how often did they come into play?

Bambina Normal kills: 2 Mohican
Graviton 1 Kolbjorn I Nessing I Mohican

Janos Normals: No wounds
Tracking Shot I Mohican 4 Kolbjorn
Expedition Used every round

Etiana Normals: I Mohican I Kolbjorn
Support Fire Used three times?
Acrobatic 2 negated

C’Rik Normals
Holographic never successful

Maekor Normals I Mohican
Company Defensive:
Plasma Blade Arc: 2 Mohican

Any additional comments (theme, balance, fun factor with and against)?

I’m warming up to the idea of the mercplorers operating as a random bonding smorgasbord, but I still think many aspects of the individual designs could be further refined.

Bambina feels good, I really like where she’s at right now.

Janos definitely seems a little overtuned, nerfs to Tracking Shot should help put him more around where he needs to be. It wasn’t relevant this game, but I also think the Rygarn synergy should be dropped.

Etiana feels a bit mechanically and thematically messy right now. Acrobatic actually makes her one of the tankier mercplorers for her point value, especially if she can get the defense boost from Maekor. This seems pretty strange to me, and not what I’d typically associate with her sculpt.

Spotter doesn’t make much sense to me as currently worded. The fact that she doesn’t need any LOS to the bonding hero, and then during her turn doesn’t need to attack anything anywhere near the bonded hero leads to very strange situations. In this game, Etiana was surrounded by Mohicans and halfway across the map from Bambina, who she couldn’t even see. However, this didn’t stop her from using her “Spotter” power to activate Bambina, then attack one of the Mohicans engaged with her. Unthematic moments like this will be relatively common, which means I think we need to go back to the drawing board a bit with this power.

C’Rik never got an OM, so I don’t have a lot to say about his performance here. I probably should have developed more slowly which would have let him join and keep up with the rest of his pals, but I got greedy trying to get the early kill on Kolbjorn.

Maekor is a beast. A very scary figure and overall I like where he’s at. However, I’ve got some issues with Company Defensive Formation as it currently stands, mainly because the name implies a mechanical parallel with Tomoe Gozen’s Defensive Formation, but the two powers are currently quite different. I think there's a couple ways we could move forward here. While a power name change would go a long way toward addressing my concerns, I still think the power itself could be a bit more streamlined. Here are my suggestions.

Quote:
MERCENARY DEFENSIVE FORMATION
If Maekor is adjacent to at least one other Mercenary you control, add 1 die to the Defense of Maekor and all Mercenaries you control adjacent to Maekor.
OR

Quote:
COMPANY DEFENSIVE FORMATION
If Maekor is adjacent to at least one other Mercenary or Explorer you control, add 1 die to the Defense of Maekor and all other Mercenaries and Explorers you control adjacent to Maekor.
I slightly prefer limiting the ability to only affecting mercenaries in the interests of distinguishing between the two classes a bit more, but I'd also be fine with the more inclusive power. This makes the ability basically irrelevant in Greenscales armies, but more effective in Janos builds.

Alternatively, if we wanted something that stayed a bit closer to the original power, I would recommend simplifying the ability to:

Quote:
MELEE COMBAT POSITIONING [or some other name that doesn't parallel Tomoe's Defensive Formation]
If Maekor is engaged, Maekor and all friendly adjacent Mercenaries [and Explorers] roll 1 additional defense die.
And for reference, here's the current (overly complicated, IMO) version of the power:

Quote:
COMPANY DEFENSIVE FORMATION
If Maekor or a friendly adjacent Mercenary is engaged, Maekor and all friendly adjacent Explorers and Mercenaries roll 1 additional defense die.
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  #106  
Old October 17th, 2021, 01:10 PM
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Re: 2021 C3V Playtest Tournament - Round 4 until 11/1

@vegietarian18 and I will be playing our round 4 game tonight at 6pm pacific time.
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  #107  
Old October 18th, 2021, 12:26 AM
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Re: 2021 C3V Playtest Tournament - Round 4 until 11/1

I lost my game to KnightOfLight tonight to end my hopes of defending my playtest tournament title. He had Zombies and I had Ants. The main lesson from this game was Zombies are good against Ants. Maybe not the best playtest data, but a good counterdraft from KoL.

I opened using Kaemon and unable-to-Hatred Marcu to build an Onslaught proof Kaemon zone on the Northern part of the board and launch some pings, but Kaemon's shots didn't do much damage. I switched over to Ants quickly as a result, but it was probably too quickly. My initial wave of Ants died only netting one or two Zombie kills. My second wave did better, having pulled the Zombies a little bit closer to my startzone I was more able to leverage Marcus and the Amberhive Queen's combat boosts, but they came up short, with maybe four Zombies remaining when the last Ant went down. Honestly I was really kept in the game by some aggressive pushes on to the Zombie Hulks to shut down Zombie turns via Horde Shriek unengaged requirement. My remaining heroes made a game of it. Marcus killed one Hulk, the Queen killed another, everyone killed a few Zombies, but the end result was the Queen taking her final wound to lava with a 1 life Ataraxis and Marcu and Isamu remaining. Good game KoL.

Ataraxis: Great game for her. One thing with the Zombies specifically is she really tips the scales on their already-favorable matchups and makes them even more favorable. 1 defense ants are very tasty food for Zombies. There was just not a whole lot the Ants themselves could do here besides hope to get lucky and blitz the Zombies out of the game.

Amberhive Queen: Weird game for her. Because the Zombie Hulks were on the board I couldn't really risk using her too close to the frontlines, so I tried to leave her in my startzone and use her aura there. I got it a few times and hit the Frenzy once. Not a bad game for her as a body on the board though. She did some work in cleanup, killing a Zombie Hulk, few Zombies. She threatened to pull out the victory at the end even though the game overall was not close. 6 move flying is just a good statline.
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  #108  
Old October 18th, 2021, 11:16 AM
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Re: 2021 C3V Playtest Tournament - Round 4 until 11/1

Scheduled for tomorrow (10/19) at 8:30am central

Quote:
The S1R_ART0R1US (2-1) v. kevindola (2-1) pool of armies is:
* Buzz-killers: Amberhive Protectors x4, Byrikon the Hiveless, Amberhive Queen, Sujoah
* Fire From Above: Greenscale Warriors x4, Marro Warriors, Kalagrith, Syvarris
* Acolytic Corverter: Acolytes of Vorganund x6, Corvor the Tainted One, Master Caylus, Marcu Esenwein
* Hunter's Moon: Mohican River Tribe x5, Kolbjorn, Van Nessing, Bol
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