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View Poll Results: Do you think that the Strategic Maneuvers should be a part of the books, or that they should have th
In the Books 164 45.81%
Like they are 194 54.19%
Voters: 358. You may not vote on this poll

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  #13  
Old September 9th, 2007, 09:52 AM
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Rÿchean Rÿchean is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tai-Pan
But please don't fill the threads up with how worthless the thread is just because you can think of better uses for them.
And what if the tactic or maneuver is presented wrong, has misleading information or in general, is a marginal tactic? As an experienced scaper, I almost feel it my obligation to the supposed newbie reading it, to let them know that the tactic is suspect, has easy counters, or would probably only work on another newbie or in a highly specialized situation. For example, one maneuver thread tells a player to put ALL 3 markers of the 2nd round on Dund. That is a bad strategy, unless of course Dund is the only figure you have left by round 2. (which isn't pointed out in that particular thread) So am I supposed to let that slide? Am I not to point out that it is bad and won't yield winning results just to keep it positive in the thread?

I hate to be so negative about the effort, but most of these sub threads with specific tactics and maneuvers, are either self evident or marginal. About half of the threads are just flat out suspect and reek of theoryscape. (like the one referenced above) Yet, somehow it is supposed to be treated as fact and even sacred ground. Where is a poster supposed to put information about the negatives, errors, and/or challenges with using some of these "strategies"?

A must read for all 'Scapers!
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  #14  
Old September 9th, 2007, 09:55 AM
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I agree with Rÿchean. I'm not particuarlly enthusiastic about any of these, and plus, at least half of them are basic tactics gone over in the books.

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  #15  
Old September 9th, 2007, 11:05 AM
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While I love the idea of "moves" that can be employed, Heroscape's order marker system and variable terrain make this difficult. In a game like Warhammer where you have tight formations of troops, every unit moves every turn, and relatively flat terrain, this kind of thing is possible. In the Art of War Sun Tzu says that a "formless" army has no readily apparent plan or weakness and is thus more effective in combat. Heroscape is more fluid than games like Warhammer and players who try to employ formations are going to find themselves outclassed by those whose forces have no shape.
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  #16  
Old September 9th, 2007, 11:24 AM
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These should be part of the existing books PERIOD! If I am looking up Swog Riders, I want all Swog info in one place.

I also want any strategy advice to be broadened with commentary from all levels of players with variety in playstyle, not just the theory of one person.

“Heroscapers is too old for that crap.”
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  #17  
Old September 9th, 2007, 11:43 AM
Tai-Pan Tai-Pan is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rÿchean
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tai-Pan
But please don't fill the threads up with how worthless the thread is just because you can think of better uses for them.
And what if the tactic or maneuver is presented wrong, has misleading information or in general, is a marginal tactic? As an experienced scaper, I almost feel it my obligation to the supposed newbie reading it, to let them know that the tactic is suspect, has easy counters, or would probably only work on another newbie or in a highly specialized situation. For example, one maneuver thread tells a player to put ALL 3 markers of the 2nd round on Dund. That is a bad strategy, unless of course Dund is the only figure you have left by round 2. (which isn't pointed out in that particular thread) So am I supposed to let that slide? Am I not to point out that it is bad and won't yield winning results just to keep it positive in the thread?

I hate to be so negative about the effort, but most of these sub threads with specific tactics and maneuvers, are either self evident or marginal. About half of the threads are just flat out suspect and reek of theoryscape. (like the one referenced above) Yet, somehow it is supposed to be treated as fact and even sacred ground. Where is a poster supposed to put information about the negatives, errors, and/or challenges with using some of these "strategies"?
Oh. Sorry, I didn't mean better uses for the strategy. I meant better uses for the thread. By all means, I want as much critique and criticism for the strategies as possible, for the reason you mentioned. I do want new players to know that the strategy won't work well against experienced players and all of that.

In response to the fluidity (if that's a word) of Heroscape, I agree. 100%. Anybody that has been playing for a long time knows how to formulate a plan and then react to any changes, BUT... there are not a lot of new players that can't do this and the strategies offer options for them as they learn.

Jugger

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  #18  
Old September 9th, 2007, 06:13 PM
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I don't understand why any of these need their own threads and index. A special post noting that Theracus with Venoc Warlord and Acolarh can fly 11 spaces on the first turn? Yeah, thanks for that. Might come in handy for those who refuse to read the books. The dreaded Deathwalker 9000 and Valguard friendly fire attack? Hope it works out for you, but it doesn't need to get stickied. A few of these are well thought-out, but I see no reason why the writers shouldn't just post their ideas in the books.

For what it's worth, I think the strategy articles that deserve to get permanently indexed are the ones like this:

http://www.heroscapers.com/community...ad.php?t=12071

It's independent of any one unit, so it can't belong in the books. And it concentrates on helping you play your own way, only better, instead of giving you a recipe for how someone else plays theirs. Finally, it's backed by tournament results, not theory.
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  #19  
Old September 9th, 2007, 10:33 PM
Tai-Pan Tai-Pan is offline
 
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Okay, once again, this whole project is not designed for experienced players. Anyone that has owned Mittens, Theracus, and Acolarh for a while knows that they can move really fast. This project is for the new 'Scaper. I'd really like for someone that has been playing for less than a month to come and tell me that my project is unorganized and unnecessary. With the exception of Bloody the Marro Stinger, everybody that has said that this is a pointless project has over 800 posts. That means that they are probably experienced (or at least decent) players, and thus, not the intended audience.

I've been in communication with Nether and am currently awaiting a response. We are trying to figure out how to make this work in the best way possible.

Jugger

It's like football with swords or LARPing without the geeky stuff. In other words, it's awesomely perfect!
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  #20  
Old September 9th, 2007, 10:43 PM
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netherspirit netherspirit is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tai-Pan
I've been in communication with Nether and am currently awaiting a response. We are trying to figure out how to make this work in the best way possible.
I think I am going to have to agree with GB on this one, all the ones that are unit specific need to be put in the respective books. That is what they are there for after all.

As for the more non-unit specific stuff, I don't see a problem having the threads out there and having this index in place....
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  #21  
Old September 9th, 2007, 10:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by netherspirit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tai-Pan
I've been in communication with Nether and am currently awaiting a response. We are trying to figure out how to make this work in the best way possible.
I think I am going to have to agree with GB on this one, all the ones that are unit specific need to be put in the respective books. That is what they are there for after all.

As for the more non-unit specific stuff, I don't see a problem having the threads out there and having this index in place....
Do you mean on the same level as "Offical Rules and FAQ's," "Heroscape News," "Official Units," and "Hersoscape General Discussion"?

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  #22  
Old September 9th, 2007, 10:56 PM
Tai-Pan Tai-Pan is offline
 
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Thank you Nether. I just got rid of the links to the single-card maneuvers and now I'm off to kill the threads.

Jugger

It's like football with swords or LARPing without the geeky stuff. In other words, it's awesomely perfect!
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  #23  
Old September 9th, 2007, 10:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tai-Pan
Thank you Nether. I just got rid of the links to the single-card maneuvers and now I'm off to kill the threads.
Hold off on that for now. A plan is in place, I'm just awaiting some more admin approval.
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  #24  
Old September 9th, 2007, 11:00 PM
Tai-Pan Tai-Pan is offline
 
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Well, I already did the links, but I can't remember how to delete the threads. If need be I can put the links back in pretty easily; I have everything in a word document on my computer. I only got rid of three things I think. Templar Charge, IX Legion Hokey Pokey, and Dund Deplocation.

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