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  #613  
Old February 14th, 2023, 12:53 AM
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Re: Wargrounds of Scape (WoS) - discussion thread

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Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
Officially submitting these 3 maps through the WoS Gauntlet...

Dralli

MidSummer

Eyohi
Thanks for the submissions. I've played Dralli a bit, definitely a useful terrain combo with just the 1x Dungeon.

I'm curious about the other two submissions because both are entries into pretty stacked spaces (although both also have some pitfalls).

How do you see Midsummer as compared to either of the WoS maps with the same combo (Percolator and Fulcrum)? What does it bring to the table?

Similarly, what is Eyohi's selling point? When I think of this combo, two of the first maps that come to my mind are The Borogoves and The Jabberwock, each of which has its own flaws. I tried to keep those flaws in mind but build on the obvious strengths when designing Wingspan and then Canary (which I hope to nominate here sometime soon, although it just got a minor tweak). Typhon's Mome Raths also uses this terrain combo and I thought he did a good job selling the highlights of his map that differ from the maps that have come before.
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  #614  
Old February 14th, 2023, 01:51 AM
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Re: Wargrounds of Scape (WoS) - discussion thread

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Originally Posted by superfrog View Post
I'm curious about the other two submissions because both are entries into pretty stacked spaces (although both also have some pitfalls).

How do you see Midsummer as compared to either of the WoS maps with the same combo (Percolator and Fulcrum)? What does it bring to the table?

Similarly, what is Eyohi's selling point? When I think of this combo, two of the first maps that come to my mind are The Borogoves and The Jabberwock, each of which has its own flaws. I tried to keep those flaws in mind but build on the obvious strengths when designing Wingspan and then Canary (which I hope to nominate here sometime soon, although it just got a minor tweak). Typhon's Mome Raths also uses this terrain combo and I thought he did a good job selling the highlights of his map that differ from the maps that have come before.
To be honest? Nothing "new" really. When designing or submitting a map, I don't consider "if it's better than, as good as or equal to" the current set of WoS maps. And I'm not sure it should be judged that way either. Seems a bit weird to judge a map by saying, "is it as good as X or Y map?" Rather, I would hope the submitted map can stand on it's own...why should it have to prove itself in comparison to what has come before? That said, you have every right in this project for that to be the standard...but if that is the expected standard for WoS, then I'd really appreciate that explained explicitly...as that would change the way I design maps going forward.

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  #615  
Old February 14th, 2023, 02:09 AM
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Re: Wargrounds of Scape (WoS) - discussion thread

Fair point. I definitely don’t usually think of comparisons when I’m designing maps, except when I’m trying to do a similar thing as a previous map. Designing Blackberry, for example, I knew I wanted a huge sprawling road like Mayberry but I didn’t want a double-wide center lateral road. Lots of others of my maps just come into being independently of other map concepts and definitely stand on their own (Sunken, Arboretum, Styx and Stones, maybe more).

That being said, I don’t intend most of my maps to be submitted to WoS. I think Wingspan v1 is one of my best 5 maps and it didn’t get any upvotes. I currently am only strongly considering 3 of my maps for eventual nomination but I’m still making edits in response to feedback I’m getting several months after posting. And when I do submit it definitely will be because I think those maps add some new archetype or terrain combo to what currently exists in WoS, and because I hope by that point they’ll have become polished and well-regarded among TDs and players.
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  #616  
Old February 14th, 2023, 04:50 AM
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Re: Wargrounds of Scape (WoS) - discussion thread

I'm gonna go ahead and give a NO to induct for Eyohi, it is a 2-hill map that seems to pull left, the side triangles looks very hard to attack into and the center is hard to navigate into. It's not Sirocco bad but there are many red flags that stand out to me, the map probably plays very fine 80% of time but there is some troublesome parts.
It's not original enough startegically-wise or aesthetically-wise in my opinion to go in deep review in spite of those red flags.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by superfrog View Post
I'm curious about the other two submissions because both are entries into pretty stacked spaces (although both also have some pitfalls).

How do you see Midsummer as compared to either of the WoS maps with the same combo (Percolator and Fulcrum)? What does it bring to the table?

Similarly, what is Eyohi's selling point? When I think of this combo, two of the first maps that come to my mind are The Borogoves and The Jabberwock, each of which has its own flaws. I tried to keep those flaws in mind but build on the obvious strengths when designing Wingspan and then Canary (which I hope to nominate here sometime soon, although it just got a minor tweak). Typhon's Mome Raths also uses this terrain combo and I thought he did a good job selling the highlights of his map that differ from the maps that have come before.
To be honest? Nothing "new" really. When designing or submitting a map, I don't consider "if it's better than, as good as or equal to" the current set of WoS maps. And I'm not sure it should be judged that way either. Seems a bit weird to judge a map by saying, "is it as good as X or Y map?" Rather, I would hope the submitted map can stand on it's own...why should it have to prove itself in comparison to what has come before? That said, you have every right in this project for that to be the standard...but if that is the expected standard for WoS, then I'd really appreciate that explained explicitly...as that would change the way I design maps going forward.
If that matters, I do not take previous inducted maps into consideration when judging, if a map is good enough to pass, even if it a similar build and sightly inferior than a previously inducted map, it gets the pass from me.
Tho I do take in account previous reviewed maps, if I see a map similar to another map that failed and I see the same problems I will definitely take it into account in my judgement.

For example in our present case some people may prefer Midsummer than Percolator aestically, or maybe it inspires them more strategically, this is all vey subjective,so as long as MidSumer is good enough in gameplay it gets the pass from me weither it is inferior or not to Percolator.


Last edited by Foudzing; February 14th, 2023 at 05:36 AM.
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  #617  
Old February 14th, 2023, 10:53 AM
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Re: Wargrounds of Scape (WoS) - discussion thread

Congratulations to @Ulysses and Percolator!
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  #618  
Old February 14th, 2023, 12:24 PM
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Re: Wargrounds of Scape (WoS) - discussion thread

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Congratulations to @Ulysses and Percolator!
Woot! Congrats @Ulysses !
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  #619  
Old February 14th, 2023, 12:48 PM
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Re: Wargrounds of Scape (WoS) - discussion thread

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Congrats to @Flash_19 for an historical record breaking 6th map induction into the BoV and/or WoS!
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Originally Posted by OEAO View Post
Congratulations @Flash_19 on the 6-peat! Truly an unparalleled level of consistency.
Thank you both for the kind words! I really appreciate it.


@Ulysses - congratulations to you!! Again, I have been very impressed with Percolator. It is an excellent addition to WoS. Thanks for all your hard work on it! I hope to see more of your maps entering the ranks in the future.


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  #620  
Old February 14th, 2023, 02:02 PM
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Re: Wargrounds of Scape (WoS) - discussion thread

Congratulations @Ulysses and @Flash_19 !
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  #621  
Old February 15th, 2023, 03:59 PM
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Re: Wargrounds of Scape (WoS) - discussion thread

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Originally Posted by OEAO View Post
Congratulations to @Ulysses and Percolator!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Typhon2222 View Post

Woot! Congrats @Ulysses !
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flash_19 View Post

@Ulysses - congratulations to you!! Again, I have been very impressed with Percolator. It is an excellent addition to WoS. Thanks for all your hard work on it! I hope to see more of your maps entering the ranks in the future.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Awaken515 View Post
Congratulations @Ulysses and @Flash_19 !
Thank you so much everyone!!! It may seem trivial to some, but this feels like a lifetime achievement for a mapmaker to be inducted into WoS! I need to thank everyone for their input on this map over the last couple years, especially @Sheep for their early support and recommendations and @OEAO for his tinkering and nudging. This really felt like a community effort. Couldn't have done it without y'all!

Gratefully ~ Ulysses
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  #622  
Old February 15th, 2023, 06:47 PM
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Re: Wargrounds of Scape (WoS) - discussion thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulysses View Post
Thank you so much everyone!!! It may seem trivial to some, but this feels like a lifetime achievement for a mapmaker to be inducted into WoS! I need to thank everyone for their input on this map over the last couple years, especially @Sheep for their early support and recommendations and @OEAO for his tinkering and nudging. This really felt like a community effort. Couldn't have done it without y'all!

Gratefully ~ Ulysses
Happy to have been a part of the Percolator story! Congrats to Percolator, and more importantly, you! What a proud achievement!
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  #623  
Old February 23rd, 2023, 08:24 PM
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Re: Wargrounds of Scape (WoS) - discussion thread

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Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
I'd like to submit Caothland for review.

Caothland
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Follow-up question on this submission since I'm hoping to start testing it after I hopefully put out my next two reviews in the next week or so:

Do you intend this map to be only used with the stated glyphs or is it more of a strong glyph/weak glyph differentiator? I could see Wannok going on the bottom, for example, or Lorja Ivor going up top.

I'm happy to test a variety of configurations, just thought I'd ask the cartographer. In the meantime I'll just assume it should be played with the glyphs shown in the build instructions.
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  #624  
Old February 23rd, 2023, 08:35 PM
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Re: Wargrounds of Scape (WoS) - discussion thread

Yes, your assumptions are correct. Lodin/Dagmar/Kelda could be up top where as the "stronger" glyphs should generally speaking be on the bottom.

This specific glyph set I chose as neither are particularly game breaking...and the map build is more about the position your taking on the terrain, and I wanted to avoid random glyphs because clearly a stronger glyph on the high side, could cause some potential issues. So the bottom side could be random, but the high side definitely needs to be a preset weaker glyph.

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