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  #25  
Old July 20th, 2008, 08:48 PM
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Re: Buffy, Angel, Firefly fans --> new from Joss Whedon...

I loved it. It started out as a comedy, but eventually became something that made you invest feelings into the show. I love crossbred genres like this. The ending was perfect. It was unexpected and interesting, which is something we don't get much of in today's media. At the end, we are left feeling unsure as to what to think about Dr. Horrible. It reminded me of Hamlet in this way. We, as veiwers, are used to knowing exactly where characters lie in the "he is a good guy/ he is a bad guy" spectrum.

Did Nathan Fillion's character remind anyone of Hancock?

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  #26  
Old July 20th, 2008, 10:02 PM
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Re: Buffy, Angel, Firefly fans --> new from Joss Whedon...

Some of this might repeat what IMAX said, but here is an e-mail I sent to a friend of mine when she asked me what I thought of it.

"This is a classic tale of the hero's journey, in the archtypical sense, but from the point of view of the villian. In the classic hero's journey, the hero will often have to overcome great adversity-in this case said obsticle is duel and presented in the forms of Capt. Hammer and the Dr.'s own social awkwardness regarding Penny. He is able to overcome both and become the full "hero", in this case a member of the Evil League of Evil, his metamorphasis shown as complete when he dons his goggles and ceases to be the blogging Dr. Horrible and becomes a full-on villian.

Of course, the nature of this transformation, since he is a villian (albeit a sympathetic one until the death of Penny) and not a hero, is one not of self-sacrifice and serving others, but rather the war of conflicting desires. On the one hand he has Penny, a pure-souled girl who, given their "moment" in episode 2, before the arrival of Capt. Hammer, Whedon seems to suggest could actually turn Billy away from his own inner darkness by her own boundless optimisim. On the other hand, of course, are his ambitions to change the world for his own benifit, to mold it to better suit his views, as exemplified, once again, as becoming a part of the League.

Penny has to die for him to become the man he becomes. As long as she is alive the duality of his desires will continue to clash, keeping him the (lovable) looser that he is. In the moment of her death he is able to harden his heart to the world in a way he simply couldn't before--note his hesitation when he goes to kill Hammer with his death ray--and he ceases to be a sympathetic anti-hero and becomes yet another sociopath who no longer sees anything beyond his own needs.

The genius, though, and the most haunting song in the production (though I actually prefered "On the Rise" from part 2 as my favorite) is shown in the lyrics of "Everything you ever". During the montage he declares he is fine with her death, and the line at the beginning, "Here lies everything / the world I wanted / at my feet / my victory's complete" has a wonderfully ambiguous meaning. Does "everything" mean Penny? If so the "victory" is obviously a hollow one, and declaring victory complete is a self-recrimination. Or does he literally mean his defeat of his enemy and newfound ability to insire fear? Or is it both?

He furthur repudiates his own softer side, as exemplified by Penny, when, in carrying her corpse he sings, "So your world's benign / so you think justice has a voice / and we all have a choice / but now your world is mine". Once again, each line has a duel meaning; her worldview meant she was soft and ended up dead, his (evil) worldview is about power. OR, she was his teather to that softer world, and now it is gone, so all that is left is his evil. OR literally, with the "voice of justice" (Capt. Hammer) defeated, the world will truly be his.

And he declares that he "is fine". We see him as a true villian now, robbing banks, enjoying the spoils of his victory and her sacrifice, and finally being welcomed into the inner circle of evil--a change shown by his new, bloody (from the human sacrifice of Penny?) costume.

Yet, as we are no longer meant to care for him, Whedon shows how choosing ambition over love has left him completely hollow with the final shot of Billy, not Dr. Evil, looking lost and alone, accompanied by "And I won't feel.....a thing."

Wow. The more I think about this webisode, the more impressed I am with it."

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  #27  
Old July 20th, 2008, 11:10 PM
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Re: Buffy, Angel, Firefly fans --> new from Joss Whedon...

That was awesome!!!!

Joss Whedon once again captured me with hie storytelling.

i agree with IMAX and Fezzik...this was the perfect ending and the only way it could end if Dr. Horrible was to be in fact Horrible

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  #28  
Old July 23rd, 2008, 11:37 AM
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Re: Buffy, Angel, Firefly fans --> new from Joss Whedon...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fezzikthedoor View Post
Some of this might repeat what IMAX said, but here is an e-mail I sent to a friend of mine when she asked me what I thought of it.

"This is a classic tale of the hero's journey, in the archtypical sense, but from the point of view of the villian. In the classic hero's journey, the hero will often have to overcome great adversity-in this case said obsticle is duel and presented in the forms of Capt. Hammer and the Dr.'s own social awkwardness regarding Penny. He is able to overcome both and become the full "hero", in this case a member of the Evil League of Evil, his metamorphasis shown as complete when he dons his goggles and ceases to be the blogging Dr. Horrible and becomes a full-on villian.

Of course, the nature of this transformation, since he is a villian (albeit a sympathetic one until the death of Penny) and not a hero, is one not of self-sacrifice and serving others, but rather the war of conflicting desires. On the one hand he has Penny, a pure-souled girl who, given their "moment" in episode 2, before the arrival of Capt. Hammer, Whedon seems to suggest could actually turn Billy away from his own inner darkness by her own boundless optimisim. On the other hand, of course, are his ambitions to change the world for his own benifit, to mold it to better suit his views, as exemplified, once again, as becoming a part of the League.

Penny has to die for him to become the man he becomes. As long as she is alive the duality of his desires will continue to clash, keeping him the (lovable) looser that he is. In the moment of her death he is able to harden his heart to the world in a way he simply couldn't before--note his hesitation when he goes to kill Hammer with his death ray--and he ceases to be a sympathetic anti-hero and becomes yet another sociopath who no longer sees anything beyond his own needs.

The genius, though, and the most haunting song in the production (though I actually prefered "On the Rise" from part 2 as my favorite) is shown in the lyrics of "Everything you ever". During the montage he declares he is fine with her death, and the line at the beginning, "Here lies everything / the world I wanted / at my feet / my victory's complete" has a wonderfully ambiguous meaning. Does "everything" mean Penny? If so the "victory" is obviously a hollow one, and declaring victory complete is a self-recrimination. Or does he literally mean his defeat of his enemy and newfound ability to insire fear? Or is it both?

He furthur repudiates his own softer side, as exemplified by Penny, when, in carrying her corpse he sings, "So your world's benign / so you think justice has a voice / and we all have a choice / but now your world is mine". Once again, each line has a duel meaning; her worldview meant she was soft and ended up dead, his (evil) worldview is about power. OR, she was his teather to that softer world, and now it is gone, so all that is left is his evil. OR literally, with the "voice of justice" (Capt. Hammer) defeated, the world will truly be his.

And he declares that he "is fine". We see him as a true villian now, robbing banks, enjoying the spoils of his victory and her sacrifice, and finally being welcomed into the inner circle of evil--a change shown by his new, bloody (from the human sacrifice of Penny?) costume.

Yet, as we are no longer meant to care for him, Whedon shows how choosing ambition over love has left him completely hollow with the final shot of Billy, not Dr. Evil, looking lost and alone, accompanied by "And I won't feel.....a thing."

Wow. The more I think about this webisode, the more impressed I am with it."
Yeah, I think I get it now... I've thought it over a lot in the past few days. I guess it was meant to get a reaction, and boy did Whedon succeed with me! The topic of the whole show was just a little too close to home for me I suppose. But at least I can grasp now that the whole point of the story is to turn Horrible from a sympathetic loser into a real villain, all while showing how easily that transformation can take place.

I suppose that I've just had my heart stomped on too many times, and that it's just a little sensitive.

Sorry for the rant earlier!
Frank'n'stay
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