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  #3733  
Old October 3rd, 2019, 04:42 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Shadow Shift is a cool power! The Horned Skull Brutes's Barge Into Battle is one of my favorite powers in the game. I noticed that Shadow Shift doesn't have many of the restrictions that Barge Into Battle does. Significantly, you could use Shadow Shift to pop Raelin (or some other figure) to safety. This doesn't seem like an intended use or a thematic fit.

Your custom probably has too much Defense.

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  #3734  
Old October 3rd, 2019, 07:43 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by capsocrates View Post
Shadow Shift is a cool power! The Horned Skull Brutes's Barge Into Battle is one of my favorite powers in the game. I noticed that Shadow Shift doesn't have many of the restrictions that Barge Into Battle does. Significantly, you could use Shadow Shift to pop Raelin (or some other figure) to safety. This doesn't seem like an intended use or a thematic fit.
Good point. Maybe limit it to Drow only? I don't love that, but it's workable and keeps you from it becoming a Get Raelin out of Jail Free card. Some other restriction could work as well. (Maybe only squads like the HSB?)

If Assassinate is only going to be usable after a Drow turn, I'd change the name to Drow Assassination or something so the more generic Assassinate can be used on a more reusable power.

I also agree with a lot of the cleaning up being suggested, like removing restrictions from Assassinate.

I think I would mildly prefer Shadow Shift to be one or the other of before/after moving, instead of allowing the player to choose.
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  #3735  
Old October 4th, 2019, 12:09 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I like restricting Shadow Shift to swapping with small/medium squad figures, personally.

Your custom probably has too much Defense.

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  #3736  
Old October 4th, 2019, 01:33 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_It View Post
Because it's locked to Once per round via the X order marker, I didn't think that "After revealing an order marker" was necessary. Even if a Bonding option is ever given to the Drow, I think it would thematic to allow Assassinate when you use it.
I don't care about theme in this case, I care about rules problems. If nothing else, if a drow hero could bond (not impossible), then you could take a turn after the hero but before the squad. An interrupt turn, where you need to remember you have another turn still coming. I don't like that, and it could easily be prevented with "after revealing an order marker."
It triggers on a Drow turn. Add the "after revealing an order marker" aspect, and it can still interrupt the turn if the bonder is designed to trigger taking their turn, after taking a turn with a squad, or trigger after taking their own turn, to then take a squad turn. But I understand what you are saying, and I'll add "after revealing an order marker".
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Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
I'm not as opposed to the X, and kinda think it's cleaner, but "once per round" seems sufficient.
Cool. Then I'll drop the "X Order marker" aspect, and just make it "Once per round".
Quote:
Originally Posted by capsocrates View Post
Shadow Shift is a cool power! The Horned Skull Brutes's Barge Into Battle is one of my favorite powers in the game. I noticed that Shadow Shift doesn't have many of the restrictions that Barge Into Battle does. Significantly, you could use Shadow Shift to pop Raelin (or some other figure) to safety. This doesn't seem like an intended use or a thematic fit.
Good point. I remember thinking about this exact issue, and I think my solution was just restrict Unique Heros... and then I forgot to add that to the card.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggaBullfrog View Post
If Assassinate is only going to be usable after a Drow turn, I'd change the name to Drow Assassination or something so the more generic Assassinate can be used on a more reusable power.

I also agree with a lot of the cleaning up being suggested, like removing restrictions from Assassinate.

I think I would mildly prefer Shadow Shift to be one or the other of before/after moving, instead of allowing the player to choose.
Drow Assassinate is an acceptable name change.

Yeah, I'll probably just make it a free once per round extra turn with no restrictions.

I really like the freedom from "before or after". It has made the Assassin very fun to play with. I don't want to restrict it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggaBullfrog View Post
Some other restriction could work as well. (Maybe only squads like the HSB?)
Quote:
Originally Posted by capsocrates View Post
I like restricting Shadow Shift to swapping with small/medium squad figures, personally.
Common Heros are a requirement. I want the Assassin to be able to shift with other Assassins, so Common Heros are a requirement. Would "a small or medium figure that is not a unique hero" work? Or would I need to say "a small or medium common, or squad figure"?

When it comes to Dalmar, I can understand, and accept that I only need to allow Squads, but with the Assassin, it is far more important to me that she be able to shift with both Common Heros, and Squads. Ideally she'd be able to shift with anyone, but Raelin exists, so every design has to deal with that existence.
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  #3737  
Old October 4th, 2019, 09:34 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_It View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggaBullfrog View Post
Some other restriction could work as well. (Maybe only squads like the HSB?)
Quote:
Originally Posted by capsocrates View Post
I like restricting Shadow Shift to swapping with small/medium squad figures, personally.
Common Heros are a requirement. I want the Assassin to be able to shift with other Assassins, so Common Heros are a requirement. Would "a small or medium figure that is not a unique hero" work? Or would I need to say "a small or medium common, or squad figure"?

When it comes to Dalmar, I can understand, and accept that I only need to allow Squads, but with the Assassin, it is far more important to me that she be able to shift with both Common Heros, and Squads. Ideally she'd be able to shift with anyone, but Raelin exists, so every design has to deal with that existence.
So just make it Common figures? Or is it important that she be able to shift with specifically Unique Squads as well? If so, what's the reasoning behind your desire there?

Personally, I wouldn't be excited to do that since, if I remember correctly, it hasn't been done on any Heroscape card before (I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure it hasn't). It would also require extra words for just a little extra benefit -- going off of previous unclear examples like Deathcommander and Dreadguls, everything would have to be spelled out, so "a small or medium common figure, or a small or medium squad figure," which I don't love. But if the reasoning is strong enough I could probably be convinced. And I'm not sure how my fellow judges feel -- they could be more or less opposed than myself.
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  #3738  
Old October 4th, 2019, 10:30 AM
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Scytale Scytale is offline
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

If you change it so that the figures do take leaving engagement attacks, it wouldn't be a "get out of jail free," and you wouldn't have to worry about limiting it.
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  #3739  
Old October 4th, 2019, 01:17 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

See what you guys think.

Figure used Orc Savage #57 Deathknell D&D Miniatures.
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  #3740  
Old October 4th, 2019, 01:26 PM
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Scytale Scytale is offline
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I think Olog is a mid-cost design forced to be 10 points. As a 10-point 1-defense figure he has little value outside of cheap cleanup. But as cleanup, both Orc Battle Rush and Savage Ambush play against that role. Orc Battle Rush pushes him closer to the initial battle lines, where he's likely to get picked off by a random attack. Savage Ambush requires you to have another figure still in play, in which case you're usually going to want to take a turn with that figure instead.

At a higher Life total and higher cost he would perform as a solid addition to a Durgeth Ravager army. They lack a good mid-cheap option (~50pts), and Olog would fit their playstyle very well.
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  #3741  
Old October 4th, 2019, 01:29 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Would an increase to life 5 be good?
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  #3742  
Old October 4th, 2019, 01:30 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

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Would an increase to life 5 be good?
I would pick a target point value and adjust the Life based on that.
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  #3743  
Old October 4th, 2019, 01:43 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

50 points Life 5 Defence 2 seems about right.
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  #3744  
Old October 4th, 2019, 01:47 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

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Originally Posted by The Long eared bat View Post
50 points Life 5 Defence 2 seems about right.
Playtest, playtest, playtest.

Run him at various life/defense until you find the value that you believe is balanced, and have results to back it up.

Let's not just toss some stats on the wall and hope it sticks

Good luck.

Have you tried Hexscape? 3D Heroscape Multiplayer Battle program!

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