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  #37  
Old July 5th, 2019, 02:43 AM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) - Design

I feel like we have a fairly simple direction here. How does everyone feel about putting something like this up in the OP?

(Figure Name)
Utgar

(We haven't discussed species much. I kind of lean giving her a direction of being a disgraced or exiled Elf Archmage from Feylund.)
Unique Hero
Archmage
Wild (I'm ehhh on this, but I don't care for the Death Knight Bonding you get from Relentless)
Medium 5

Life: 5/6
Move: 5
Range: 6/7
Attack: 3/4
Defense: 2/3
(Since we're balancing two attack modes, her normal attack should be worthwhile as well. 4 attack at 7 range is quite strong, perhaps a bit much, and 6 life 3 defense is a bit too much survivability for this type of figure I feel. I'd be fine with 5 life 3 def or 6 life 2 def though..)
Points: ???

Power 1
Twin Flamethrower Special Attack

Range 3/4 Attack 3/4
Choose two straight lines from (figure name), each 3/4 spaces long. All figures on those spaces who are in line of sight are affected by (figure name's) Twin Flamethrower Special Attack. Roll 3/4 attack dice for all affected figures. Affected figures roll defense dice separately. (Figures with the Lava Resistant special power are not affected by Twin Flamethrower Special Attack.)

(Again, fairly simple choices here that we can tweak as we go. I think I like Range 3 Attack 4 best for this special, 4/4 feels like a bit much. I put the not affecting lava resistant thing in brackets just because if we don't go for Heat Absorption on the Firecats then I don't think we need that line, but that has more to do with another design than it does this one.)
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  #38  
Old July 5th, 2019, 02:46 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) - Design

I have no disagreement with Utgar. The coloration and fire fits him well.

I'm not opposed to Elf Archmage. Wild seems a good fit for the playstyle so far, but we do have to consider Death Knights. I don't thing she'll be too good for them, though, even with a multi-target special attack. (Actually, it would be a good thing for them.)

I agree 7 Range/4 Attack is too good. 7/3 is good enough. 6 Life/3 Defense is also too good.

4 Range on Twin Flamethrower is too much. 4 Attack probably is too; but I'm not certain. I agree the Lava Resistant thing should only be added if it works with the cats.

I very much like keeping this to a single-power unit.
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  #39  
Old July 5th, 2019, 05:36 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) - Design

I suppose testing will sort this out but:

3 attack on normal feels underwhelming if this is an offensive unit, especially if we tone down the aoe to 2 lines of 3. I think this unit wants to be fairly close to the fighting so they can pick the best time to run in and burn down a bunch of units and it has to walk. Longer range with weaker attack seems at odds with it's purpose. For that reason I think 4 attack seems right.


6/3 feels pretty strong, Mimring is a 5/3 and is obviously similar.


The special power seems fine although I don't like cats gaining back markers, especially if the only way to do it in set is to take this character with them.
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  #40  
Old July 5th, 2019, 05:46 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) - Design

I personally prefer 3 attack at 7 range with a 4 attack special. A long-range attack of 3 feels like it gives her options but still cleanly defines that she can do the most damage up close with her SA. At 4 attack at that range, it starts to feel like she's best played by hanging back and not going for the special at all until the opponent rushes her, at which point she doesn't really get any weaker and could be frustrating to play against. Alternatively we could go 4 attack at a shorter range, but just giving her two different close-range attacks doesn't offer much of a choice in how to play.

For the SA, in comparison with Fireline it has less range and thus puts her in more danger but has probably better multi-target attack potential. Even with 4 dice I don't think she outclasses Mimring just because being able to use that 8 range is really good, and Mimring has a lot more mobility. Only reason I'd see to make the SA use 3 dice would be to fit her into a lower price bracket, something closer to 100 rather than floating around 130 or up.
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  #41  
Old July 5th, 2019, 09:57 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) - Design

Quote:
Originally Posted by All Your Pie View Post
I feel like we have a fairly simple direction here. How does everyone feel about putting something like this up in the OP?

(Figure Name)
Utgar

(We haven't discussed species much. I kind of lean giving her a direction of being a disgraced or exiled Elf Archmage from Feylund.)
Unique Hero
Archmage/ Wizard (too much synergy with Elf Wizards?)
Wild (I'm ehhh on this, but I don't care for the Death Knight Bonding you get from Relentless)
Medium 5

Life: 5/6
Move: 5
Range: 6/7
Attack: 3/4
Defense: 2/3
(Since we're balancing two attack modes, her normal attack should be worthwhile as well. 4 attack at 7 range is quite strong, perhaps a bit much, and 6 life 3 defense is a bit too much survivability for this type of figure I feel. I'd be fine with 5 life 3 def or 6 life 2 def though..)
Points: ???

Power 1
Twin Flamethrower Special Attack

Range 3/4 Attack 3/4
Choose two straight lines from (figure name), each 3/4 spaces long. All figures on those spaces who are in line of sight are affected by (figure name's) Twin Flamethrower Special Attack. Roll 3/4 attack dice for all affected figures. Affected figures roll defense dice separately. (Figures with the Lava Resistant special power are not affected by Twin Flamethrower Special Attack.)

(Again, fairly simple choices here that we can tweak as we go. I think I like Range 3 Attack 4 best for this special, 4/4 feels like a bit much. I put the not affecting lava resistant thing in brackets just because if we don't go for Heat Absorption on the Firecats then I don't think we need that line, but that has more to do with another design than it does this one.)
My vote is for Relentless Elven Archmage
Utgar or Vakrill
Life 4
Defense 2
No lava resistance

Normal Attack 3 Range 7
Special attack range 4 attack 4

Last edited by Fakeraistlin; July 7th, 2019 at 02:15 AM. Reason: Question of synergy/ Overpowered unit for Elf Wizard
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  #42  
Old July 6th, 2019, 03:18 AM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) - Design

We definitely don't need to make her special as good as Fire Line. Take note that it's much more controllable--it will be far easier to hit numerous targets than with Fire Line. That's why I'm against Range 4 and Attack 4. Attack 4 alone has some serious potential to wreck squads. Range 4 gives her the option of hanging back a bit, plus makes it easier to hit more targets. Let's keep ourselves in check here.
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  #43  
Old July 6th, 2019, 09:50 AM
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Cool Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) - Design

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
We definitely don't need to make her special as good as Fire Line. Take note that it's much more controllable--it will be far easier to hit numerous targets than with Fire Line. That's why I'm against Range 4 and Attack 4. Attack 4 alone has some serious potential to wreck squads. Range 4 gives her the option of hanging back a bit, plus makes it easier to hit more targets. Let's keep ourselves in check here.
Maybe make special 3 attack and 3 range with
choice to either increase attack or range by 1.
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  #44  
Old July 6th, 2019, 03:10 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) - Design

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fakeraistlin View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
We definitely don't need to make her special as good as Fire Line. Take note that it's much more controllable--it will be far easier to hit numerous targets than with Fire Line. That's why I'm against Range 4 and Attack 4. Attack 4 alone has some serious potential to wreck squads. Range 4 gives her the option of hanging back a bit, plus makes it easier to hit more targets. Let's keep ourselves in check here.
Maybe make special 3 attack and 3 range with
choice to either increase attack or range by 1.
The attack is already wordy enough as it is. Let's pick Range 4 or Attack 4 and stick with it.
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  #45  
Old July 6th, 2019, 03:14 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) - Design

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fakeraistlin View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
We definitely don't need to make her special as good as Fire Line. Take note that it's much more controllable--it will be far easier to hit numerous targets than with Fire Line. That's why I'm against Range 4 and Attack 4. Attack 4 alone has some serious potential to wreck squads. Range 4 gives her the option of hanging back a bit, plus makes it easier to hit more targets. Let's keep ourselves in check here.
Maybe make special 3 attack and 3 range with
choice to either increase attack or range by 1.
The attack is already wordy enough as it is. Let's pick Range 4 or Attack 4 and stick with it.
Then Attack 4 Range 3 is my vote ... and adjust as per playtest.
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  #46  
Old July 8th, 2019, 11:00 AM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) - Design

Basically with good placement I see her Special attack getting:
Range 3 attack 4 = ~2 attacks of 4
Range 4 attack 3 = ~3 attack of 3
Range 4 attack 4 = ~3 attack of 4

I'd prefer more range as it makes opponent's think about placement more and therefor makes both the player and oppnent have to learn to be more strategic, which is a + in my book. I do agree that 4 Range and 4 attack is too OP, as most times you could roll 8 or 12 dice, possibly up to 24 dice!

I also do like LAVA RESISTANCE and OBSIDIAN FIELD (to help Blazing Firecats power up with Heat Absorption)
Quote:
All land spaces adjacent to [CN,P] are considered lava field spaces [for special powers and end of the round rolls].

*[Brackets] optional for clarity.
Utgar seems appropriate, not sure on left box stats.
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  #47  
Old July 8th, 2019, 12:16 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) - Design

Quote:
Originally Posted by All Your Pie View Post
I feel like we have a fairly simple direction here. How does everyone feel about putting something like this up in the OP?

(Figure Name)
Utgar

(We haven't discussed species much. I kind of lean giving her a direction of being a disgraced or exiled Elf Archmage from Feylund.)
Unique Hero
Archmage
Wild (I'm ehhh on this, but I don't care for the Death Knight Bonding you get from Relentless)
Medium 5
One other thing to consider when discussing her class is that some people are thinking about giving the Illusions synergy with all archmages, so that they would work with both the Jace Illusionist figure (if he is also made an archmage) while also providing some synergy with Sonlen as well. I'm not necessarily opposed to allowing Chandra to synergize with the Illusions as well; in fact I think it could allow for greater diversity in army building within the master set to give the Illusions two characters for them to synergize with in the master set. Its just something to keep in mind if that is the direction you do decide to go.
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  #48  
Old July 8th, 2019, 01:27 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) - Design

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Stupendous View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by All Your Pie View Post
I feel like we have a fairly simple direction here. How does everyone feel about putting something like this up in the OP?

(Figure Name)
Utgar

(We haven't discussed species much. I kind of lean giving her a direction of being a disgraced or exiled Elf Archmage from Feylund.)
Unique Hero
Archmage
Wild (I'm ehhh on this, but I don't care for the Death Knight Bonding you get from Relentless)
Medium 5
One other thing to consider when discussing her class is that some people are thinking about giving the Illusions synergy with all archmages, so that they would work with both the Jace Illusionist figure (if he is also made an archmage) while also providing some synergy with Sonlen as well. I'm not necessarily opposed to allowing Chandra to synergize with the Illusions as well; in fact I think it could allow for greater diversity in army building within the master set to give the Illusions two characters for them to synergize with in the master set. Its just something to keep in mind if that is the direction you do decide to go.
On the discord before the project began, there was also some push to make Nissa an Archmage (since we canít make her a Wizard lol).

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