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C3G Legacy Archive of all the original discussions and workshops from the first stage of C3G.

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  #1909  
Old August 15th, 2020, 01:34 AM
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Re: Ronin's Public Workshopping Thread

Neat write up! I'd lean towards Android here over Kaiju, but I like him either way.

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  #1910  
Old August 15th, 2020, 07:41 AM
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Re: Ronin's Public Workshopping Thread

Very cool.
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  #1911  
Old August 16th, 2020, 07:34 PM
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Re: Ronin's Public Workshopping Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin View Post
Quote:

The figure used for this unit is a Playmates: Toys figure from the Godzilla set.
Its model name and size are SpaceGodzilla / 6.5".

NAME = SPACEGODZILLA
SECRET IDENTITY =

SPECIES = KAIJU
UNIQUENESS = EVENT HERO
CLASS = CONQUEROR
PERSONALITY = MALEVOLENT

SIZE/HEIGHT = HUGE 18

LIFE = 20

MOVE = 6
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 7
DEFENSE = 6

POINTS = ???


TELEKINETIC SLAM SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 3. Attack 5.
After a figure defends against this special attack, you may immediately place it on any empty spaces within 4 spaces of its original placement. That figure will not take any leaving engagement attacks. After using this special attack for the first time this turn, you may attack one additional time with a normal or special attack.

CORONA BEAM SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 7. Attack 4.
Choose a non-adjacent figure to attack. No clear line of sight is needed when attacking with this special attack. All figures adjacent to the chosen figure are also affected by this special attack. Roll 4 attack dice once for all affected figures. Each skull rolled counts as one additional hit. Figures roll defense dice separately.

BENEATH HIS NOTICE
SpaceGodzilla may attack non-adjacent huge figures if he is engaged only with figures that are not huge.

SUPER STRENGTH

FLYING
His unfortunately-named breath weapon can be controlled and redirected mid-air, so I tried to ape Darkseid's Omega Beam mechanics a bit. The whole thing's aiming to be kind of a mix between that and Godzilla's SA.

I'm excited about this template. I've thought a lot about this, so I put together a collage that might help explain where I see this character much differently.

I agree with the left-side attributes.

I do think that Beneath His Notice is a nice power for a Kaiju, and keeps with the theme of him being a Conqueror, as he was determined to take out Godzilla first in order to clear his path to world domination.
However, there are so many other powers that SpaceGodzilla has, that I think it'd be a low-priority power for him specifically. He also only fought Godzilla, Little Godzilla, and MOGERA, which are all Huge, so there's really no reference as to how he would react to non-huge opponents.

I like Telekinetic Slam, but I feel like maybe it should be Move Opponent's figure, then roll attack dice. Right now it reads as though the character gets knocked in a direction, rather than a pick up and throw down.


As for how to make Corona beam stand out against other Kaiju beams, I like the idea that he doesn't need LOS, but the beam itself isn't so much an Area-of-Effect blast, it's more surgical and deliberate. For example, MOGERA blasts off a shoulder crystal with the missiles from his hands, so SpaceG retaliates by Corona-Beaming off one of MOGERA's arms. Maybe an auto-wounder? Or a small number of unblockable attack dice?
I also think it could be a not-so-powerful beam that can be made more powerful the more Crystals SpaceGodzilla is adjacent to.

And now, I have to get into the Crystals. His dorsal fins are crystals, his claws are crystals, his shoulders are obviously giant crystals. SpaceG is all about the crystals, and that should be central to how he plays.

Crystals are the source of SpaceG's power. When he arrives on the scene, he terraforms the skyline to surround himself with them. (A) The crystals on his shoulders are conductors that draw power from crystals he's raised that then becomes his power source. (A,B) His shoulder crystals had to be destroyed in order to be weak enough for Godzilla to kill him. (C)
He can use his energy to deflect ranged attacks, or even reflect them back at the enemy. (D) He's not agile and effective in CQC, but when powered up, his skin zaps those who touch him, kind of like Dr. Doom. (E1, E2)




He can use crystals as projectile weapons, called Homing Ghost, which I could see as being worked into Telekinetic Slam.



And when he moved Little Godzilla and Godzilla with telekinesis, he'd lock them down with crystals.


I hope it's not unhelpful to just suggest rough ideas, but I'd say, give him relatively lower base stats, and have him come co-drafted with a unique squad of 4 crystals that he can erect on the board after taking a turn, and destroyed crystals can return to the battlefield as long as SpaceGodzilla is alive. Crystals he's adjacent to will buff his stats, and can be Telekineticly Slammed into the enemy and destroyed. And opponent's figures adjacent to 4 crystals may not move.

Not saying this is the best option, but a quick search on etsy has 5 crystal obelisks for $13:
https://www.etsy.com/listing/2505010...search_click=1
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  #1912  
Old August 16th, 2020, 08:46 PM
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Re: Ronin's Public Workshopping Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by toyhandle View Post
I'm excited about this template. I've thought a lot about this, so I put together a collage that might help explain where I see this character much differently.

I agree with the left-side attributes.
Groovy.

Quote:
I do think that Beneath His Notice is a nice power for a Kaiju, and keeps with the theme of him being a Conqueror, as he was determined to take out Godzilla first in order to clear his path to world domination.
However, there are so many other powers that SpaceGodzilla has, that I think it'd be a low-priority power for him specifically. He also only fought Godzilla, Little Godzilla, and MOGERA, which are all Huge, so there's really no reference as to how he would react to non-huge opponents.
True that reacting to small opponents isn't a huge part of his story in the movie, but in C3G it's naturally gonna come up a lot, and I just think it'd be really lame if he could get mobbed by a bunch of civilians and not be able to fight bigger enemies. It's important to me mainly for that reason.

Quote:
I like Telekinetic Slam, but I feel like maybe it should be Move Opponent's figure, then roll attack dice. Right now it reads as though the character gets knocked in a direction, rather than a pick up and throw down.
Good call. I was a little worried about the theme feeling off there, and you pointing it out just highlights that it's wonky. We'll have to change the order of operations there.

Quote:
As for how to make Corona beam stand out against other Kaiju beams, I like the idea that he doesn't need LOS, but the beam itself isn't so much an Area-of-Effect blast, it's more surgical and deliberate. For example, MOGERA blasts off a shoulder crystal with the missiles from his hands, so SpaceG retaliates by Corona-Beaming off one of MOGERA's arms. Maybe an auto-wounder? Or a small number of unblockable attack dice?
I also think it could be a not-so-powerful beam that can be made more powerful the more Crystals SpaceGodzilla is adjacent to.
Hmm. Like Beneath His Notice, the AoE mechanic in Corona Beam is a place where I was cheating a bit towards the pragmatics of who he's fighting. (And somewhat wanting to ape Godzilla's mechanics) I think here you're right that the present version isn't super evocative.

Quote:
And now, I have to get into the Crystals.

[I've snipped out a lot of the following to avoid building a giant Jenga tower of quotes - Ronin]

I hope it's not unhelpful to just suggest rough ideas, but I'd say, give him relatively lower base stats, and have him come co-drafted with a unique squad of 4 crystals that he can erect on the board after taking a turn, and destroyed crystals can return to the battlefield as long as SpaceGodzilla is alive.
Oh no, not unhelpful at all. It's a workshop, not a museum. I almost tagged you when I posted the write-up, because I was curious about your take, but I figured you might just wander in on your own time. And so you have!

On the Crystals, though: you're right that they'd be cool to bring in. But I probably wouldn't make them automatically co-drafted. We haven't got any released examples yet (unless you count the vehicles, but those are a bit different), but C3G has been dabbling in draftable destructible objects lately.

I'd probably leverage that and draw up a draftable Crystal DO that you could draft however many of you wanted. That would let him scale a bit to different point values (and desired complexity). If you just want a slightly weaker, simpler-to-play SpaceGodzilla without any crystals to manage, I also like that being an option, gameplay-wise.

That in mind, right now I'm thinking along these lines for changes:

a) Keep SpaceGodzilla's M/R/A/D pretty much where they are - I think you can only go so low with a character like this. (Captain America trows 6 Attack dice, you know? Feels weird for SpaceGodzilla to not be dropping some dice, crystals or no crystals)
b) Reduce his Life stat a bit.
c) Draw up a Draftable DO for a crystal. One power that lets it get placed on the battlefield by SpaceGodzilla, one power that either reduces incoming damage to SpaceGodzilla, or heals him. So now in conjunction with (b) he's a bit more fragile but draws strength from the crystals.
d) Change up Corona Beam a bit (details TBD), and give it a bonus for nearby crystals.
e) Change the order of operations on Telekinetic Slam so that it's throw, then roll attack dice.
f) Maybe also, in place of the multi-attack bit of TS, make it so that other figures adjacent to the thrown figure get hit. That would naturally incorporate throwing the crystals, like you mentioned, and it'd give him an AoE option, since we're likely taking that out of Corona Beam.

I probably wouldn't try to implement the "crystal jail" bit in the powers; they're naturally gonna restrict movement just by taking up space.
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  #1913  
Old August 17th, 2020, 09:54 AM
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Re: Ronin's Public Workshopping Thread

Cool stuff! I'm loving the development of the Kaiju wing of C3G!

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DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #1914  
Old August 17th, 2020, 08:12 PM
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Re: Ronin's Public Workshopping Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin View Post
That in mind, right now I'm thinking along these lines for changes:

a) Keep SpaceGodzilla's M/R/A/D pretty much where they are - I think you can only go so low with a character like this. (Captain America trows 6 Attack dice, you know? Feels weird for SpaceGodzilla to not be dropping some dice, crystals or no crystals)
b) Reduce his Life stat a bit.
c) Draw up a Draftable DO for a crystal. One power that lets it get placed on the battlefield by SpaceGodzilla, one power that either reduces incoming damage to SpaceGodzilla, or heals him. So now in conjunction with (b) he's a bit more fragile but draws strength from the crystals.
d) Change up Corona Beam a bit (details TBD), and give it a bonus for nearby crystals.
e) Change the order of operations on Telekinetic Slam so that it's throw, then roll attack dice.
f) Maybe also, in place of the multi-attack bit of TS, make it so that other figures adjacent to the thrown figure get hit. That would naturally incorporate throwing the crystals, like you mentioned, and it'd give him an AoE option, since we're likely taking that out of Corona Beam.

I probably wouldn't try to implement the "crystal jail" bit in the powers; they're naturally gonna restrict movement just by taking up space.
Ah, I see why he needs options to prevent getting tied down by the little guys. Godzilla can already smash them. I assume Rodan's Supersonic Flight would disengage, on top of his ability to blow figures around. And I see the need for AoE attacks for that same reason. I suppose all Kaiju will need to have some appropriate method of crowd control. I liked Beneath His Notice before, but I like it even more now.

Maybe the Telekinetic Slam could affect 1 figure, or up to 2 DO's. And if he targeted a figure, he may then use his Corona Beam Special Attack. And on the Crystal's card,

Homing Ghost
Crystals are destroyed after being moved by Telekinetic Slam. Attack dice are instead rolled once for all figures adjacent to the space last occupied by the moved Crystal. Affected figures roll defense dice separately.

So now, he is likely going to either use two AoE attacks or two individual attacks.

And with the Captain America example in mind, one thing I love about this game is the power scaling between figures.

Cap's attack of 6 compared to Spidey's Attack of 4 (+SS+WebSlinger) being a great example.

Cap isn't stronger than Spidey, but he's not pulling his punches like Spidey. And Spidey has the option of knocking opponents back and throwing DO's, as well as a good chance of causing opponents to roll fewer defense dice. So a weak punch from Spidey still hurts a lot more than it would normally.

I agree, SpaceGodzilla should have a decently high normal attack. After his shoulders were destroyed, he speared MOGERA in the chest with his tail, lifting him up, and tossed him through the air like the Alien Queen on Bishop. However, up until that point, he was relying on his Beam, his Telekinesis, and his Crystal-Manipulations. Often, he was causing Godzilla to be punished for attacking. So, in order to get some Crystal representation on his card, without necessitating Crystals be drafted into the army, what about something like:

CRYSTAL DEFENSE
Roll 1 unblockable combat die against opponent's figures ending movement adjacent to SpaceGodzilla. (example e1,e2) If SpaceGodzilla is attacked by any opponent's non-adjacent figure and at least 1 skull is rolled, roll the 20-sided die. If you roll 1-12, roll defense normally. If you roll 13-16, 2 shields will block all damage. If you roll 17 or higher, SpaceGodzilla receives no wounds, and the attacking figure takes 1(or 2) wound/s. (example d) If there are 15 or more wound markers on this card, SpaceGodzilla is no longer considered to have Crystal Defense. (representing his shoulders being destroyed)

The first part of that power might be good enough crowd control that he won't need Beneath his Notice.

Once MOGERA and Godzilla got past his defenses, he was pretty easy to wound. MOGERA was digging in pretty good with that nose drill, and SpaceG's tiny arms are somewhat useless.

And on the Crystal's Card:

CRYSTAL ERECTION
After taking a turn with a SpaceGodzilla you control with the Crystal Defense special ability, you may place up to 2 Crystals in your army on the battlefield. Crystals adjacent to SpaceGodzilla add 1(or 2) to his defense while he has the Crystal Defense special ability.

Of course these are all just suggestions and ideas. I'm sure a lot of those values I gave could use tweaking. And the last power could likely use a name change.
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  #1915  
Old August 17th, 2020, 08:49 PM
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Re: Ronin's Public Workshopping Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by toyhandle View Post
CRYSTAL ERECTION
I mean, I know he has a lot of crystals on his body and all, but eeesh ....

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DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #1916  
Old August 18th, 2020, 12:32 AM
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Re: Ronin's Public Workshopping Thread

Joking, CRYSTAL TERRAFORMING might be a better name.
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  #1917  
Old August 18th, 2020, 06:33 AM
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Re: Ronin's Public Workshopping Thread

There we go.

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DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #1918  
Old August 18th, 2020, 10:17 PM
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Re: Ronin's Public Workshopping Thread

I dig the general idea behind Crystal Defense, but it's a bit complex. Trimming that down and writing out some of what we talked about, how would you feel about:

Quote:
NAME = SPACEGODZILLA
SECRET IDENTITY =

SPECIES = KAIJU
UNIQUENESS = EVENT HERO
CLASS = CONQUEROR
PERSONALITY = MALEVOLENT

SIZE/HEIGHT = HUGE 18

LIFE = 17

MOVE = 6
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 6
DEFENSE = 5

POINTS = ???


TELEKINETIC SLAM
After moving and before attacking, you may choose a figure within 4 clear sight spaces of SpaceGodzilla. Place the chosen figure on any empty space within 4 spaces of its original placement. That figure receives a wound. Then, if that figure is huge, you may roll an unblockable attack die, one at a time, against each figure it was placed adjacent to. Placed figures will not take any leaving engagement attacks.

CORONA BEAM SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 7. Attack 2 + Special.
Choose a non-adjacent figure to attack. No clear line of sight is needed. Roll 1 additional attack die for each Crystal Destructible Object within 2 spaces of SpaceGodzilla, to a maximum of +3. Each skull rolled counts as one additional hit.

CRYSTAL DEFENSE #
At the end of an enemy figure's turn, if it attacked SpaceGodzilla this turn or ended its turn adjacent to SpaceGodzilla, roll the 20-sided die. If you roll # or higher, that figure receives a wound.

SUPER STRENGTH

FLYING
__________________________________________
NAME = CRYSTAL
TYPE = COMMON DESTRUCTIBLE OBJECT

SIZE/HEIGHT = HUGE ??

LIFE = 1
DEFENSE = 7

POINTS = ???


CRYSTAL TERRAFORMING
Crystals do not start the game on the battlefield. After taking a turn with a figure you control that has the Crystal Defense special power, you may choose up to two Crystals that have not yet been placed on the battlefield, or one Crystal that was previously destroyed. Place the chosen Crystals on empty spaces within 2 spaces of a figure you control that has the Crystal Defense special power.

DEFENSIVE ENERGY SOURCE
Figures within 2 spaces of this Crystal that have the Crystal Defense special power roll 1 additional die against adjacent attacks, or 2 additional dice against non-adjacent attacks.
Trying to do it all as cleanly as possible here.

I remembered, when trying to word Telekinetic Slam, why I had the order of operations the other way originally - going the evocative route on an SA (movement before rolling dice) opens up weird edge cases that I'd rather not address in an SA. (Since it gives SpaceGodzilla a way to put figures in a position where he couldn't normally attack them, before rolling dice)

So I rebranded it as an after-moving/before-attacking auto-wounding thing. Honestly it might make more sense that way anyhow, given the timing we wanted it to have? (ie comboing with another normal or special attack)
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  #1919  
Old August 18th, 2020, 10:46 PM
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Re: Ronin's Public Workshopping Thread

Should there be any height restriction on the slam? If the slam is how I'm picturing it thematically, might be odd to use it to throw someone to the top of a skyscraper or a mountain.

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DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #1920  
Old August 18th, 2020, 11:00 PM
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Re: Ronin's Public Workshopping Thread

He lifts things up and he puts them down.

He's a big, crazy character, so I don't have a problem with him lifting someone super high to slam them into the top of a tall structure.
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