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  #37  
Old August 30th, 2006, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Venom
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Originally Posted by countblah


Back on topic: Anyone else see that episode of mythbusters where they were examining free energy. One that got close: a big wheel of propane tanks, with a pool of water at the bottom. When the water got warm, the propane would evaporate, and then condense in the propane tank above it, thus making it heavier, and turning the wheel. Convoluted, but it was the closest thing they found to free energy...


Still remarkably inefficient.
someday man. our technology will be better and hey maybe we'll find a cure to AIDS as well.
Cure for AIDS = prevention and education. Then it goes away. If people don't engage in activities that are totally risky, then they don't catch the disease. Remarkably simplistic, but there you go.

Waiting for my old avatar to dry off. And to quit stinking, too.

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  #38  
Old August 30th, 2006, 02:50 PM
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And usually the simpler ideas are the better ones. Kind of like Heroscape!
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  #39  
Old August 30th, 2006, 08:21 PM
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I agree guys, if you dont put yourself in the position where you contract something, the disease doesnt spread and dies out.

Tiberius is Rogue...
aboard STARSHIP THETA...
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  #40  
Old August 31st, 2006, 12:30 AM
Venom Venom is offline
 
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yeah, but there are always stupid people out there.

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  #41  
Old August 31st, 2006, 12:53 AM
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Wow. Ok, to get this thread back on track:

All you dudes who claim this is feldercarb (and it probably is, for the record) must realize that the only proof you can offer is that which is based on the current theories of physics. You can slap all the formulas and equations down that you want, but the only thing it really says is "if our current theories of physics are accurate and complete, this technology is impossible."

How many of you out there honestly believe that we know everything that there is to know about physics, and that 100% of our theories are correct beyond question, with no exceptions?

<crickets chirp>

Yeah. That's what I thought.
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  #42  
Old August 31st, 2006, 01:36 AM
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Our current theories very well may need to be updated in our lifetime, but I don't think that a single observation is enough to be even a blip on the radar. The theories we have have held up for a while with no serious challengers. I would imagine there was some observational error, or something that someone is missing. It happens all the time. Theories don't become theories from just a single set of data. There needs to be a lot of independent scrutiny, so it isn't all chalked up to a great big "duh" moment. Cold fusion anyone?
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  #43  
Old August 31st, 2006, 01:45 AM
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Yes, I totally agree with that sentiment, Minivann.

But the one of the things I love about the scientific method (as opposed, in particular, to religious beliefs) is that true scientists admit that they very well may be wrong. You won't find too many religious folks to admit the same thing. I certainly don't want this to derail this thread into a science vs. religion debate, but I wanted to point out that the very nature of pure science involves the admission of possible alternative theories. So the dudes on this thread that seem to be claiming that they know for certain that such a thing is impossible are violating the very premises upon which they base their claims.
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  #44  
Old August 31st, 2006, 01:54 AM
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Heh, I don't know everything, but I'll interupt those crickets.

This is feldercarb. If it is true, we would have to start over from square one, and the theories that we've built the last 150 years of civilization on are complete garbage.

Quote:
"What we have developed is a way to construct magnetic fields so that when you travel round the magnetic fields, starting and stopping at the same position, you have gained energy," McCarthy said.

"The energy isn't being converted from any other source such as the energy within the magnet. It's literally created. Once the technology operates it provides a constant stream of clean energy," he told Ireland's RTE radio.
The most important principle of physics is the conservation of energy. Its simple, its clean, and proved multiple times that its correct. "Its literally created" is the red flag.

I would be happy to give you a list of things we don't know about physics, and there are a startling amount of them, but this is something we are sure about.

Also, the guy is going about it all wrong, from a social perspective. This isn't the way things are done to gain academic respect. This is the way things are done to make a profit and scam investors, which is exactly this guy's goal.

well, here's an article
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_motion

Argh. Stop believing in free energy people! You can believe in free energy when I meet elves and fairies and Klingons and a lich and a great frost wyrm and ....
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  #45  
Old August 31st, 2006, 02:01 AM
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I would be happy to give you a list of things we don't know about physics, and there are a startling amount of them, but this is something we are sure about.
That very sentiment, as I noted in my last post, is also a "red flag," to use your own term. Science is never "sure about" anything. Those who tell you otherwise are probably trying to sell you something. Again, I want to mention that I'm fairly sure that this is a load of feldercarb, but to automatically discount a claim before validation and verification is scientific folly.
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  #46  
Old August 31st, 2006, 02:02 AM
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hehe, read the Structure of Scientific Revolutions by Thomas Kuhn, and you'll find out just how unbiased scientists are.

Read the equally good Karl Popper if you want a better outlook on science and the evolution of the scientific method.

I mean, I admit that conservation of energy could be flawed, but it would take a LOT more to convince me than one scam artist.
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  #47  
Old August 31st, 2006, 02:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CornPuff
hehe, read the Structure of Scientific Revolutions by Thomas Kuhn, and you'll find out just how unbiased scientists are.
Scientists are human, and as such, they make mistakes and have biases. To discredit the scientific method because some have abused it is a spurious argument.
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  #48  
Old August 31st, 2006, 02:23 AM
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Its not discrediting the scientific method, only people that use it are human, so.....

One of the points is that people see what they want to see. Its a double bladed sword. I see the situation as feldercarb because it doesn't adhere to the current paradigm. Their scientists, if in fact they have any young'ns that believe their own lies, are blinded the other way and will have trouble admitting wrong.

The other point, which is a bit cynical, is that old generations must die off for a new paradigm to be instituted. So Kuhn was saying that the majority of the scientific body would literally have to die for perpetual motion to be accepted as truth.

I know I'm sorta arguing your side here, but you'll have to kill me before you can have your free energy

On another note, if you want something that can overturn current paradigms, try incorporating gravity or neutrino oscilations into the standard model, or explaining entangled electrons. I just saw some news the other day about how the speed of light is perhaps not constant over time. Which means its not constant over space either. way cool.

These are some accepted observations that could overturn the foundations of physics once we are able to come up with a consistent model including them, and no matter how much it flips our current understanding of physics, I'm ready for the headtrip.

But when it comes to this article, its still complete feldercarb.
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