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  #7465  
Old December 6th, 2021, 02:27 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

I don't know if it's worth having a marker-based power on a filler-ish hero. In general we avoid making marker-based powers as it's something that's easy to overuse. But it is interesting in this case, a hero that pretty much only exists to bond.

to review Kirvin the Wily
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  #7466  
Old December 19th, 2021, 02:33 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

I think that the resubmission of the Feral Swog still feels like it exists just to bond three ways. Beast Training lands better than most conditional class-changing powers because it paints a theme leaning on the well-established orcs, but I'm not confident that this theme is strong enough to carry an entire design. That said, the rest of the card is streamlined enough that I'm willing to give it a shot to see if the varied bonding squads end up telling a story strong enough to justify each synergy. to review.

The card image for Kirvin the Wily hosted on Discord is no longer visible, @SchismaticSounds . Do you mind posting a new image?
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  #7467  
Old December 19th, 2021, 02:35 PM
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SchismaticSounds SchismaticSounds is offline
 
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

@superfrog @vegietarian18 @wriggz @BiggaBullfrog @Astroking112

A friendly reminder that there are submissions to vote on. Let us know if you have any questions.

Edit: Good timing Astro. Original post link has been replaced with the updated submitted card thereafter.

Adapt what is useful, Discard what is not, Add what is uniquely your own.

Last edited by SchismaticSounds; December 19th, 2021 at 03:21 PM.
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  #7468  
Old December 20th, 2021, 04:47 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

to review Kirvin the Wily. Very interesting design space here as he could prove to be quite an asset to Greenscale builds. A backup lizard king, even a fragile one, is a great fallback for a strong build that has traditionally had the weakness of putting all its eggs in one basket.

on Feral Swog. It's such a simple and creative design, and the bonding is ultimately probably okay everywhere it has been or has not been. I will say I really was not a fan of the constant back and forth on the synergies here and was close to voting no out of principle. Please for the other designers in the future: come in to SoV nomination with a cohesive idea of your design and don't let others persuade you to change it.
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  #7469  
Old December 20th, 2021, 11:49 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

tentative to Kirvin the Wily. Like the design, dislike the mini.

to Feral Swog.

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  #7470  
Old December 21st, 2021, 02:29 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Thank you judges for your consideration

Is it the armor that doesn't mesh well for you superfrog?
Although it is a troglodyte figure, it looks more lizardfolk than the other trog minis and much to the likes of the Blackscale Lizardfolk in smaller armored form. Perhaps you would have liked the Lizardfolk Mireborn or Lizardfolk Warrior #12 more for this character? Unfortunately, they are hardly available.

Here are a few more photos for stature comparison and images of those other minis.
Spoiler Alert!
Spoiler Alert!


Another option would be the Iruxi defender #10 I just discovered which could be more convincingly a part of the lizardfolk army and is very well in stock.
Spoiler Alert!

However, I think this mini would sway back into ullar territory.
Not to be fickle towards my own design, but for flexibility, this could be a backup for if there came to be enough consensus for such a change.

Given that the Lizardfolk already bond with the many different dragon designs though, I don't think they would be too partial to the Troglodyte mini among them.

Adapt what is useful, Discard what is not, Add what is uniquely your own.

Last edited by SchismaticSounds; December 21st, 2021 at 06:32 PM. Reason: wording fix
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  #7471  
Old December 21st, 2021, 03:12 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by SchismaticSounds View Post
FWIW- after seeing these photos of the mini chosen for Kirwin on the board, I think it fits particularly well within the Utgar umbrella. It's very reminiscent of the Knights of Blackgaard armor.
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  #7472  
Old December 28th, 2021, 07:00 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

I have some reservations about the playability of Kirvin the Wiley given the offensive focus on a backup bonder with 3/3 stats (one of the original main appeals of a second Lizard King was to keep the stat boost for Greenscales), but 50 points is very affordable and he could open up the Greenscale army-building space even further. I'm willing to see how he plays on the board and if it functions well. to review.
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  #7473  
Old January 7th, 2022, 10:40 AM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

The Feral Swog has received 5 Yea votes to review (wriggz, Scytale, Astroking112, vegietarian18, and superfrog) and moves forward in the process.

Kirvin the Wily has received 4 Yea votes to review (Scytale, vegietarian18, superfrog, and Astroking112) and moves forward in the process.
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  #7474  
Old January 7th, 2022, 10:55 AM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by SchismaticSounds View Post
I would like to officially submit Kirvin The Wily.
What is Kirvin's homeworld?
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  #7475  
Old January 7th, 2022, 11:44 AM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SchismaticSounds View Post
I would like to officially submit Kirvin The Wily.
What is Kirvin's homeworld?
Toril. Just like the Greenscales.

Adapt what is useful, Discard what is not, Add what is uniquely your own.
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  #7476  
Old January 9th, 2022, 02:56 AM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

After roughly 1.5yrs of design and playtesting... @Leaf_It and I have come here with what we believe to be a great addition to the canon.

Leaf_It and I submit the High Dune Scorpions



Climb the highest dune in the Skeldor Desert, disturb the sands of the Blasted Lands, and you will hear them coming.

High Dune Scorpions are the Fake Plastic Scorpions from Cooplay.

Balance
This was the biggest hurdle. For many months we knew the theme, we knew the basic statline (mostly...sometimes it changed), we knew what we wanted...but we just couldn't get the balance right with the power set. Previous iterations made the sting ability too offensively strong, others made carapace the signature ability and made them nigh unkillable and yet others just didn't play like a scorpion squad would. What we have here, is truly the most balanced we could get within the design space we were going for.

Potential Issues we faced with this design, and overcame with the current iteration:
  • Estivara (Venomous Sting impact). As Arachnids, she'd get them an attack boost that we couldn't ignore. So, we had to make the attack power weak enough not to make her a auto-draft in their armies but not so weak that the design was unexciting. The current iteration does this. With just 2 attack dice, their ability to bypass defense rolls is VERY exciting (and terrifying), but doesn't necessarily make you want Estivara in the army. She will increase dice rolled, but at the cost of activating their power less. While she may still be a strong draft choice, we wanted to make sure the design had a reason NOT to draft her (higher chance of autowounds) in order to balance them.

  • Raelin (Carapace impact). As a 4-figure common squad with a defensive ability, we really needed Raelin to be accounted for. Raelin of course is good for the D and A tier figures...but we wanted to make sure the design didn't have built-in advantages to taking Raelin. In other words, we didn't want a defensive ability that scaled stronger the more defense dice you roll (Tough or Warforged Resolve LOVE Raelin). Carapace allows for this. We wanted Carapace to be an occasional, thematic and useful ability that showed up but wasn't the signature ability of the design. As-is, we feel we've accomplished that. No matter if on Shadow, height, next to Jungle or in Raelin's aura, Carapace remains the same. It only ever allows you to re-roll 1 dice that did no show a shield. In fact, you only ever roll for Carapace if you've failed to block a 1 skull attack or nearly failed to block an attack. AND Raelin's aura (and other defense buffs like height) only ever help you block the initial attack from an opponent (just like any other unit), while Carapace is only rolled for in the even you've failed that initial defense. Defense bonuses and Raelin really just make it more likely to block an attack, not necessarily more likely to need to roll for Carapace. We've witnessed that in our games where with or without Raelin we roll Carapace 6-10ish times a game out of 24-30ish defense rolls. It's pretty consistent regardless of Jungle/Shadow/Raelin.

Playability
The simplicity is rich here. The design reuses one established power and another power that's similar to what we've seen from Kiova. This card is not difficult to figure out or understand. They are a fun and useful squad that can be the center of an army or splashed in as a small screen/sharky attack force.

Creativity
We've taken something simple and well known (a scorpion) and brought it to life into the Heroscape world with accurate abilities of how we'd expect a Scorpion to operate. That's creativity. We didn't need to give them magic missiles or anything fancy, as that doesn't "fit" the mini or theme we've that needs to be portrayed. Sometimes being creative can be designing something that is expected, but in the best and most accurate way possible.

Theme
They are a perfect size for Heroscape. Their coloring is good and matches what you'd expect to see in the High Dunes which is where we've placed them; on an established world with a barren wasteland: Arctorus and the Blasted Lands. Their abilities are absolutely perfect for what they do and it comes through in gameplay. Venomous Sting is accurate and useful, and Carapace - while not armor - does assist as a softer exoskeleton-type shell. The defensive ability shows up on occasion to make a save, but does not impose itself upon the design. Carapace for creatures like this is useful, but doesn't do much for a Giant stomping on them.

Accessibility
VERY AVAILABLE for a common squad

Amazon can max out your cart (24 sets of 20)
$5 for 20 minis (5 squads) = $1 per squad

Walmart can max out your cart (12 sets of 100)
Multiple listings $18-$19 for 100minis (25 squads) = $0.72 per squad

Lots of eBay listings


Additional Comments/Considerations:
  • The original minis come with their tails a little flatter and off to the side. The minis are a soft plastic and very malleable and easy to reshape. If desired for a little more dynamic look, it literally takes a couple minutes with a hair dryer to heat up the tail and prop it upright.

  • Playtesting showed these guys hanging around the B- to B range. They occasionally went toe to toe with A stuff (usually lost though), other times losing to low tier stuff...but generally hanging around where we'd expect them to in the B range.

  • In-game decisions. This design makes for very interesting in-game decisions. Often you're faced with the predicament of either taking height (usually advantageous for most units) or remaining same/low ground to get a higher chance of pulling off the sting. I found this very good for the design as it made for greater depth of choice during gameplay. Look for that as you test.

  • Non-bonding squad

  • The design is neither a Hero Killer or a Squad Killer design...but a happy medium between being effective at fighting both.

  • Ideal/strong armies to test with:
    Scorps X4, Rae, Rygarn, MW's, Marcu
    Scorps X4, Rae, Krav, MW's, Isamu
    Scorps X4, Rae, Q10, Isamu

  • Some might think Carapace might be cumbersome with a lot of re-rolling. I don't think that's much the case. There are a lot more scenarios where you don't roll Carapace than there are where you do.

    Don't Roll Carapace If:
    1. Opponent whiffs
    2. Opponent rolls 1 skull and you block
    3. Opponent rolls 2 skulls and you whiff
    4. Opponent rolls 3+ skulls

    Roll Carapace If:
    1. Opponent rolls 1 skull and you whiff
    2. Opponent rolls 2 skulls and you roll 1 shield
    *Assumes no defense bonuses.

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