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  #61  
Old October 4th, 2021, 02:46 PM
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Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs [ILVARA THE DROW OM HUB]

Quote:
Originally Posted by AndreThaGiant
Good catch- I must have uploaded an older version. Do note that Ilvara also gets that shadow bonus, so her defense is 4 in actuality. Think that will be problematic?
Nah, 4/4's are still squishy in my book. The low life makes them unreliable when it comes to survivability. It's the reason why Agent Carr and Kaemon never quite do it for me.

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  #62  
Old October 4th, 2021, 02:51 PM
AMIS AMIS is online now
 
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Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs [ILVARA THE DROW OM HUB]

I think the 130 cost is great for this figure. Defense of 4 is good.

Corpse Collector or Honor In Death doesn't really make a difference to me...except I do not see Honor in the Drow race. But that could be me.

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Last edited by AMIS; October 4th, 2021 at 02:54 PM. Reason: Defense or defence? I never get those right.
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  #63  
Old October 4th, 2021, 03:02 PM
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AndreThaGiant AndreThaGiant is offline
 
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Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs [ILVARA THE DROW OM HUB]

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Originally Posted by AMIS View Post
I think the 130 cost is great for this figure. Defense of 4 is good.

Corpse Collector or Honor In Death doesn't really make a difference to me...except I do not see Honor in the Drow race. But that could be me.
Honor In Death does sound more Einar than anything, now that you say it. Thanks for stopping by
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  #64  
Old October 4th, 2021, 10:04 PM
Blue Trails Blue Trails is offline
 
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Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs [ILVARA THE DROW OM HUB]

I like what you have so far for Ilvara. The Drow were a neat faction, so it's nice to see someone try to make them work a little better. I am interested in knowing whether you mean for this to be the exact, named character you've included below the card.

I should tell you that I had also worked on Drow support at one point; I mention this only to because it means I can say from experience that powers like SHADOW AURA will inevitably cause unforeseen problems for the faction. Because the Drow don't have any power hitters, a special power that boosts their opponents' Defense values is going to be painful, especially when the buffed figures have engaged something as valuable as an OM hub/bonding piece. Furthermore, Ilvara's Range of 1 is strongly anti-synergistic with Shadow Aura, as the inability to strike beyond the aura's reach means she's making nearly every figure she attacks artificially tougher.

I would recommend either combining HONOR IN DEATH and LOLTH'S BLESSING into a single power to make space on the card, dropping Ilvara's Defense to 2, and recycling the Varkaanan Darkclaws' SHADOW MASTER power; or bumping her Defense to 4 and changing Shadow Aura to something like this:
Quote:
SHADOW AURA
All land spaces within 1 space of Ilvara that are no more than 5 levels above or below Ilvara's base are considered shadow spaces for the purpose of special powers on any Army Card.
Both options preserve Ilvara's current survivability while preventing her from nerfing her own damage output. The second idea's loss of a Defense boost for friendly figures is admittedly a shame, though.
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  #65  
Old October 5th, 2021, 10:35 AM
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AndreThaGiant AndreThaGiant is offline
 
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Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs [ILVARA THE DROW OM HUB]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Trails View Post
I like what you have so far for Ilvara. The Drow were a neat faction, so it's nice to see someone try to make them work a little better. I am interested in knowing whether you mean for this to be the exact, named character you've included below the card.

I should tell you that I had also worked on Drow support at one point; I mention this only to because it means I can say from experience that powers like SHADOW AURA will inevitably cause unforeseen problems for the faction. Because the Drow don't have any power hitters, a special power that boosts their opponents' Defense values is going to be painful, especially when the buffed figures have engaged something as valuable as an OM hub/bonding piece. Furthermore, Ilvara's Range of 1 is strongly anti-synergistic with Shadow Aura, as the inability to strike beyond the aura's reach means she's making nearly every figure she attacks artificially tougher.

I would recommend either combining HONOR IN DEATH and LOLTH'S BLESSING into a single power to make space on the card, dropping Ilvara's Defense to 2, and recycling the Varkaanan Darkclaws' SHADOW MASTER power; or bumping her Defense to 4 and changing Shadow Aura to something like this:
Quote:
SHADOW AURA
All land spaces within 1 space of Ilvara that are no more than 5 levels above or below Ilvara's base are considered shadow spaces for the purpose of special powers on any Army Card.
Both options preserve Ilvara's current survivability while preventing her from nerfing her own damage output. The second idea's loss of a Defense boost for friendly figures is admittedly a shame, though.
Great points. What about an aura that only affects friendly figures?
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  #66  
Old October 5th, 2021, 10:47 PM
Blue Trails Blue Trails is offline
 
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Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs [ILVARA THE DROW OM HUB]

Quote:
Originally Posted by AndreThaGiant View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Trails View Post
I like what you have so far for Ilvara. The Drow were a neat faction, so it's nice to see someone try to make them work a little better. I am interested in knowing whether you mean for this to be the exact, named character you've included below the card.

I should tell you that I had also worked on Drow support at one point; I mention this only to because it means I can say from experience that powers like SHADOW AURA will inevitably cause unforeseen problems for the faction. Because the Drow don't have any power hitters, a special power that boosts their opponents' Defense values is going to be painful, especially when the buffed figures have engaged something as valuable as an OM hub/bonding piece. Furthermore, Ilvara's Range of 1 is strongly anti-synergistic with Shadow Aura, as the inability to strike beyond the aura's reach means she's making nearly every figure she attacks artificially tougher.

I would recommend either combining HONOR IN DEATH and LOLTH'S BLESSING into a single power to make space on the card, dropping Ilvara's Defense to 2, and recycling the Varkaanan Darkclaws' SHADOW MASTER power; or bumping her Defense to 4 and changing Shadow Aura to something like this:
Quote:
SHADOW AURA
All land spaces within 1 space of Ilvara that are no more than 5 levels above or below Ilvara's base are considered shadow spaces for the purpose of special powers on any Army Card.
Both options preserve Ilvara's current survivability while preventing her from nerfing her own damage output. The second idea's loss of a Defense boost for friendly figures is admittedly a shame, though.
Great points. What about an aura that only affects friendly figures?
Good idea; retaining the defense boost helps justify a 130-point price tag, and the Drow really appreciate as many synergy effects as possible. It's also less drastic of a change to your original power set than what I suggested, which is nice.
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  #67  
Old October 6th, 2021, 10:37 AM
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Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs [ILVARA THE DROW OM HUB]

Updated. I'm liking where she's at.

@AMIS @TheAverageFan @Blue Trails @SchismaticSounds
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  #68  
Old October 6th, 2021, 01:19 PM
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Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs [ILVARA THE DROW OM HUB]

I thought that her aura was up to 5 spaces before writing this, so discard what you may.
Though giving shadow to your opponents could make things harder on yourself, thematically, I can’t see it not affecting your enemies. If it is selective then it feels forced and probably too powerful. It should already be powerful if played well in positioning your figures and preventing others from getting into the aura. Her points are higher for now, but I wouldn’t mistake her as lackluster for having 2 separate strongly synergetic systems. Granted her shadow could make combat more tedious for other figures around her. Could think about lowering its distance a bit. I feel like giving her 4 attack would help iron out her attack output issue under shadow while remaining part of her theme as having some base magic attack. Flesh of Lolth strikes me as a more mature name and less Heroscape-y to me in that way. I don’t have much to comment on with her bonding systems. In conjunction with her shadow aura, she brings a lot to the table which could very well make her fit the points she is at.. I think theory-scaping a custom will only get you so far though without seeing how her mechanics operate in a real game scenario which will often times help you see quite quickly where something could/should be adjusted.
As I mentioned, I wrote this thinking her aura was up to 5 spaces. I think if it were longer, it could make the shadow benefiting synergies more interesting, but I’d reduce it to a point that it is not overly influencing. A one space shadow aura might be fine. I’d just have to see how it plays in game besides being the hub for your shadow loving figs, but in theory, it’s less interesting to me as it could be if it were a bit wider an affect.

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  #69  
Old October 6th, 2021, 02:02 PM
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Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs [ILVARA THE DROW OM HUB]

I'd add a "may" to Shadow Aura, so that friendly figures that had a terrain bonus that isn't shadow, can choose not to be affected by it. Then again, the range is only 1, and having a downside isn't a bad thing...

Also, no other figure with an aura is affected by their own aura. (unless I'm forgetting something) Even if you want her to be affected by it, unless you explicitly state that she is in the ability itself, most players that encounter her or the first time will not play her that way. It would be better for new comers to the design for her to just have 1 more defense, and not allow her to be affected by the aura.
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  #70  
Old October 6th, 2021, 03:22 PM
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Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs [ILVARA THE DROW OM HUB]

Quote:
Originally Posted by SchismaticSounds View Post
I thought that her aura was up to 5 spaces before writing this, so discard what you may.
Though giving shadow to your opponents could make things harder on yourself, thematically, I cant see it not affecting your enemies. If it is selective then it feels forced and probably too powerful. It should already be powerful if played well in positioning your figures and preventing others from getting into the aura. Her points are higher for now, but I wouldnt mistake her as lackluster for having 2 separate strongly synergetic systems. Granted her shadow could make combat more tedious for other figures around her. Could think about lowering its distance a bit. I feel like giving her 4 attack would help iron out her attack output issue under shadow while remaining part of her theme as having some base magic attack. Flesh of Lolth strikes me as a more mature name and less Heroscape-y to me in that way. I dont have much to comment on with her bonding systems. In conjunction with her shadow aura, she brings a lot to the table which could very well make her fit the points she is at.. I think theory-scaping a custom will only get you so far though without seeing how her mechanics operate in a real game scenario which will often times help you see quite quickly where something could/should be adjusted.
As I mentioned, I wrote this thinking her aura was up to 5 spaces. I think if it were longer, it could make the shadow benefiting synergies more interesting, but Id reduce it to a point that it is not overly influencing. A one space shadow aura might be fine. Id just have to see how it plays in game besides being the hub for your shadow loving figs, but in theory, its less interesting to me as it could be if it were a bit wider an affect.
Why couldn't you see it not affecting enemies? Raelins aura only affects friendlies, and Estivaras only spiders. I could explore extending her aura, although that gets to be A LOT of shadow. I'll run some tests on each one. Your idea does seem more viable in theory.

Based on lore from D&D, when the Drow die they are usually wrapped in silk and delivered to Lolth (a spider god) to be eaten. An excerpt from Forgotten Realms, "From early childhood, all Drow know that they exist only to provide their goddess with food and pleasure."

Perhaps flesh is disturbing to some, and I'm open to renaming it. But this is derived straight from the lore, and is politically correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_It View Post
I'd add a "may" to Shadow Aura, so that friendly figures that had a terrain bonus that isn't shadow, can choose not to be affected by it. Then again, the range is only 1, and having a downside isn't a bad thing...

Also, no other figure with an aura is affected by their own aura. (unless I'm forgetting something) Even if you want her to be affected by it, unless you explicitly state that she is in the ability itself, most players that encounter her or the first time will not play her that way. It would be better for new comers to the design for her to just have 1 more defense, and not allow her to be affected by the aura.
Valid point, Leaf. I'm taking Schismatic's suggestions into consideration. Although, the current text is almost an exact mirror of Re-Tak-Shi's SWAMP OOZE. Obviously, I'm not going to call it SHADOW OOZE, but the verbiage of RTS's insinuates that she is also affected. If AURA isn't the proper lingo, I'm very open to alternatives.
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  #71  
Old October 6th, 2021, 04:14 PM
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Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs [ILVARA THE DROW OM HUB]

I don't question the defense and attack auras so much in their theme, but how I imagine it is the staff she's holding forms a void of light in the area around her, generally unmanipulated as a vision ward, but mobile. I think it encourages more strategic positioning which might help tone everything she brings to the table. 5 spaces would probably be too much. 4, likely. Would play around in the 2-3 space zone, but some amount of bleed which allows the enemy to use it to some advantage I think could make things interesting.

I'm not super apposed to the abilities name, it just stands out to me the most. I'm sure there are some other grimly named abilities that C3V has broken new ground with. Flesh does put me off just a little more from what I think would be in classicscape.
That is a pretty grim prospect of lore though.

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  #72  
Old October 6th, 2021, 05:52 PM
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Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs [ILVARA THE DROW OM HUB]

I approve of the current version. Trading dead Drow for turns is nice thematically and gives Pelloth more incentive to use his signature ability and gives it more value. Flesh For Lolth I like more than the previous two names. She's also not so strong as to make Drow super competitive, still best used for smaller games or D&D Scape scenarios.

Even though auras never affect the figure using it, they always specify that it doesn't affect them in the card text, so the default is that it does affect them if not otherwise specified. Having it be more than one space would be very strong for the Drow since Hide In Darkness is very powerful while on Shadow Spaces. Having a wider aura that turned rock spaces into dungeon spaces would be neat for a less powerful buff using a underused tile type, but that'd really be pushing it for text on the card.

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