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C3G Legacy Library This is the archive for all the designs released in the original era of C3G. Feel free to post any figure specific questions in their individual books.

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  #121  
Old January 10th, 2015, 06:37 PM
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Re: The Book of Commander Rogers

Thanks, V! By my count, he's gone 4-4 in the post reeval tests so far (1, 2, 3). I would be fine with 250 or 260 here. Any other thoughts?

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  #122  
Old January 11th, 2015, 02:16 PM
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Re: The Book of Commander Rogers

I like 260.

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  #123  
Old January 12th, 2015, 08:12 AM
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Re: The Book of Commander Rogers

May I ask what the change to Photonic Energy Shield is? I can't remember it.
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TB is often one of the most helpful and respectful people here so you shouldn't be taking his comments as disrespectful or belittling. L_O is another story, he sometimes comes off gruffer than he intends but he means well.
Just noticed this - I'm not going to argue it, it's true, I just wonder why you felt the need to mention it here?


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  #124  
Old January 12th, 2015, 09:34 AM
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Re: The Book of Commander Rogers

The PE Shield:

When defending against an attack, Commander Rogers always adds one automatic shield to whatever is rolled. When Commander Rogers defends against a normal attack from a figure within 5 clear sight spaces, if there are excess shields rolled, the attacking figure receives one wound.

It used to affect all attacks, not just normal, and the auto-shield would go towards the excess shields for the auto-wound.
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  #125  
Old January 12th, 2015, 04:31 PM
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Re: The Book of Commander Rogers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aggressive Sock View Post
The PE Shield:

When defending against an attack, Commander Rogers always adds one automatic shield to whatever is rolled. When Commander Rogers defends against a normal attack from a figure within 5 clear sight spaces, if there are excess shields rolled, the attacking figure receives one wound.
"If there are excess shields rolled" is a bit awkward; would you like to use the same wording as Marrow's SPIKE DEFENSE?
... if you roll any excess shields, the attacking figure receives one unblockable wound.
I'm not sure if you actually want "unblockable" or not — I assume this changes whether something like Stealth Armor 15 could apply — but it's always good to use the same wording when going after the same effect.

EDIT: I just realized I missed the fact that you're intending to exempt the auto-shield from counting toward the excess shields. I don't think that's clear, especially since "added" skulls and shields probably need to be treated as having been "rolled" for various other definitions in the game. It seems like this needs to be made explicit, rather than relying on some definitional hair-splitting.
... if you roll any excess shields (before adding the automatic shield), the attacking figure receives one unblockable wound.
Unfortunately my suggestion is a bit awkward, but it's a rather odd concept to begin with: you have an extra shield, but it doesn't count as an extra shield because you didn't actually roll it. Maybe there's another way to get to the math you're after?

This is probably not any better:
... if you roll two or more excess shields (including the automatic shield), the attacking figure receives one unblockable wound.
Actually that seems worse, but I guess it helps illustrate the fact that the underlying math is a bit fiddly. If there is any way to streamline this, that would be a good thing.


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Last edited by Just_a_Bill; January 12th, 2015 at 06:00 PM.
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  #126  
Old January 12th, 2015, 06:26 PM
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Re: The Book of Commander Rogers

JaB, you're right on the "unblockable" part (though there is no difference in gameplay, it's more in line with Heroscape convention). The math with Photonic Energy Shield isn't immediately obvious, but I'm against using parentheses in powers. I don't think that's something that was ever done in official Heroscape.

Maybe this would be better?
Quote:
When defending against an attack, Commander Rogers always adds one automatic shield to whatever is rolled. When Commander Rogers defends against a normal attack from a figure within 5 clear sight spaces, if there are two or more excess shields, the attacking figure receives one unblockable wound.

".... the Cambridge ladies do not care, above
Cambridge if sometimes in its box of
sky lavender and cornerless, the
moon rattles like a fragment of angry candy"
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  #127  
Old January 12th, 2015, 06:32 PM
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Re: The Book of Commander Rogers

FWIW, I thought it was pretty clearly worded. If you just glance over it, sure, you'll probably miss interpret it, but when you read it I think it states it clearly that only shields rolled are what count towards the auto-wound.

But, that change would work too.
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  #128  
Old January 16th, 2015, 12:57 PM
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Re: The Book of Commander Rogers

C3G STANDARD PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM

NAME OF THE TEST UNIT Commander Rogers

- THEME TEST/ Check to see if there are any powers or stats on the test unit card that does not accurately reflect the theme or likeness of what the character would and could do. Also consider destructible objects, and whether or not this characters powers should affect them.
Pass

- MIRROR TEST/ Check to see if the unit were played against itself, if there would be any loops that would upset the balance of the Game.
Pass

- BONDING TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing Bonding abilities to make sure there are no continual Bonding possibilities that do not stop appropriately or do not stop at all. This is to prevent loops in Bonding.
Pass

- SYNERGIES TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing synergies to make sure there are no factors that could break the game by making any unit to powerful or too weak.
Pass

- POWER CHECK/ Consider the test unit and all existing units and all glyphs to compare to and check for any powers that could be over amplified and break the game. Each power must define when it takes place, who or what it affects, and What are the stipulations on the power if there are any.
Pass

- FUN TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play.
Pass

- FUN COMPETITIVE TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play against.
Pass

- DRAFTING TEST/ Consider whether or not this design is worth drafting.
Pass

- USAGE TEST/ Consider whether or not all of the powers on this card were used or at least usable.
Pass


Army Test #1
- Does it pass
Yes or NoYes
- What should be the unit's point value? 230~250
- Give a brief overview. Criminals made it a tuff one, Kingpin got the Glyph of Experimental Medicine, Hawkeye got the Power Gem and was a Powerhouse, both sides stayed away from the Glyph of Bifrost, because it didn't benefit either side. Commander Rogers was a big factor in the win, He has the kill shot. Rogers stayed back, waited for the Criminals come to Him, and took Height.
Map: Sacred Shrine Map. Glyphs Used: Bifrost, Power Gem, and Experimental Medicine.
Units: Commander Rogers, Black Widow, Stealth Iron Man, S.H.I.E.L.D. Agents, Nick Fury, and Hawkeye I.(1170)Kingpin, Tombstone, Wrecker, Piledriver, Thunderball, and Bulldozer. (1180)[/B]
Spoiler Alert!

Playtest One Battle Log.
Spoiler Alert!



- STRATEGY TEST/ Consider whether or not the design offers any real strategy or interesting tactics to the overall game.
Pass
_____________________________________________________________
Army Test#2
- Does it pass
Yes or NoYes
- What should be the unit's point value? 250
- Give a brief overview. This was a very close match, with a unit like the Agents you have to be strategic, unfortunately I was not in this game, it seamed as though every time I could get in position to attack there would be Ranged attacks from every corner. I didn't keep Commander Rogers back witch is another reason I lost, He is so valuable late in games when your team starts falling. I went more ground and pound this game. It worked early, until I got overwhelmed by the opposing force. Even so it was a good close tight game, it could of gone either way, witch is always the result you want.
Map: Sacred Shrine Map. Glyphs Used: Temporal Displacement, Time Gem, and Experimental Medicine.
Units: Commander Rogers, Black Widow, Nick Fury, S.H.I.E.L.D. Agents, Ant-Man(Eric O'Grady), x3 Swarm Of Fire Ants, Killer Bee, Mystique, Sharon Carter, and Dum Dum Dugan.(1200)Batman#1,Robin(Tim Drake), Alfred Pennyworth, Hawkeye II, Red Arrow, Green Arrow, Black Canary, and Merlyn.(1190)


Spoiler Alert!


Spoiler Alert!



Last edited by Midgieboy3; January 16th, 2015 at 02:59 PM.
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  #129  
Old January 16th, 2015, 02:14 PM
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Re: The Book of Commander Rogers

Quote:
Originally Posted by TrollBrute View Post
I'm against using parentheses in powers. I don't think that's something that was ever done in official Heroscape.
There are 14 Hasbro cards that use parentheses.

I'm not saying that they have to be used here, but in general ... in those cases where parentheses would be the best way to make something both clear and readable, why prohibit them?

I once had a boss who was always against semicolons (not sure why), but after a while he was able to appreciate how sometimes they were just the best tool for the job, like most other punctuation symbols. (Once in a while, they were pretty much the only way to make a game text fit on one of our cards and still remain clear; otherwise we would have had to reduce the font size below our minimum standard.)


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  #130  
Old January 16th, 2015, 02:22 PM
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Re: The Book of Commander Rogers

I really have no strong preference one way or another, but parenthesis would certainly help in several cases with the wording of powers. There's just certain occasions that call for explanation or specifying something, that end up leading to confusion, that could possibly be avoided with parenthesis.
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  #131  
Old January 16th, 2015, 05:30 PM
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Re: The Book of Commander Rogers

The official usage of parenthesis, was it on any pre-DnD cards?
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  #132  
Old January 16th, 2015, 08:59 PM
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Re: The Book of Commander Rogers

@Midgieboy3 , thanks for the tests! As I mentioned before, if you are worried about your tests being too long, you could easily shorten it. We don't really need every power mentioned by name when it is used, especially when the tested unit is not being used. Here's a stab at shortening the first two rounds of your second game:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Midgieboy3 View Post
Spoiler Alert!
It's probably still more than I would include in my tests, but it's a lot easier to read, while still including plenty of information.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_a_Bill View Post
I'm not saying that they have to be used here, but in general ... in those cases where parentheses would be the best way to make something both clear and readable, why prohibit them?
I'm not against them, per se (I use parentheses a lot in my own writing), but we try to stick as close as possible to the way the original cards were written. I was not aware that parentheses were ever used in Classic. Do you mind pointing me to a few examples?

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moon rattles like a fragment of angry candy"
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