Street Fighter Design Thread - Ryu and Guile

[Scapemage]

Lead Designer Johnny139

RYU

HUMAN
UNIQUE HERO
FIGHTER
DISCIPLINED

MEDIUM 5

LIFE 6

MOVE 5
RANGE 1
ATTACK 4
DEFENSE 5

150 POINTS

HADOUKEN SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 5. Attack 4 + Special.
Ryu cannot attack a figure whose base is more than 3 levels above his height or 3 levels below his base with his Hadouken Special Attack. If there are at least 3 Wound Markers on this card, roll 2 additional attack dice.

TATSUMAKI SENPUU
Instead of moving normally, you may place Ryu on any adjacent space no more than five levels above or below his base. After moving with Tatsumaki, Ryu may attack any or all adjacent figures. Roll 1 less attack die for each subsequent attack.

[Scapemage]

Lead Designer BurnyFlame

GUILE

HUMAN
UNIQUE HERO
SOLDIER
BOLD
MEDIUM 5

LIFE 5
MOVE 5
RANGE 1
ATTACK 3
DEFENSE 5

??? POINTS

SONIC BOOM SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 6. Attack 3.
The Sonic Boom Special Attack can only be used on figures whose base is on the same level as Guile's base. If Guile's Sonic Boom Special Attack inflicts a wound, remove one unrevealed Order Marker at random from that figure's Army Card (or cards if your opponent has more than one Common card for that figure).

FLASH KICK
Guile rolls 2 additional attack dice if he did not move this turn. When Guile attacks a figure with the Flying special ability, he rolls 2 additional attack dice.

A SOLDIER'S VENGEANCE
If at least one Unique Soldier Hero in your Army has been destroyed, Guile may take one additional turn every time you reveal an Order Marker on Guile's Army Card.

[BurnyFlame]

Since I am scheduled for Chun-Li and Guile, I would like to stagger them instead of doing two in a row, so perhaps as the second figure we could work on Guile? Again, here is what I have for him:
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Guile

Human
Unique Hero
Soldier
Bold
MEDIUM 5

5 Life
5 Move
1 Range
3 Attack
5 Defense

Sonic Boom Special Attack
Range 6. Attack 3.
The Sonic Boom Special Attack can only be used on figures whose base is on the same level as Guile's base. If Guile's Sonic Boom Special Attack inflicts a wound, remove one unrevealed order marker at random from that figure's Army Card (or cards if your opponent has more than one Common card for that figure).

Somersault Kick
If Guile did not move this turn, add 2 to his attack dice. When Guile attacks a figure with the Flying special ability, add 2 additional attack dice.
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I don't know if, in addition to "Flying" figures, I should mention "Stealth Flying" as well in the second power. Or better yet, I could mention "Levitation" as a power, and we can give that power to M. Bison, making Jean-Clau--er, I mean Guile effective against him.

[Scapemage]

Sure, working on Guile seems good right now. I'll add him to the second post, as Ryu is in the first post.

When commenting on a design, remember to specify which design it is your commenting on.

Ryu - Love this design. Very interesting aspect for his movement power.

Guile - Soldier is a great personality, but should we be consistent and make everyone have the Fighter class?

I see plenty of wording changes here, I'll tidy up the wordings in a bit. Otherwise, great design. I think Guile comes in at around 150, which is good, what were you thinking as far as points Burny?

[qt.bangerang]

Ryu - I really like the movement special a lot.

Guile - I really like "Somersault Kick" but it should be called "Flash Kick." Also, I don't think that they all need to be "fighters" I like that Guile is a solider...E. Honda can be Sumo, etc.

I would also like to see them have different base stats...Right now these 2 are the same, which is ok as long as the rest of the figures don't end up with the same base stats.

[Scapemage]

Originally Posted by qt.bangerang

Ryu - I really like the movement special a lot.

Guile - I really like "Somersault Kick" but it should be called "Flash Kick." Also, I don't think that they all need to be "fighters" I like that Guile is a solider...E. Honda can be Sumo, etc.

I would also like to see them have different base stats...Right now these 2 are the same, which is ok as long as the rest of the figures don't end up with the same base stats.

Definitely name it Flash Kick.

Now that I think of it, I agree with you on the class thing.

Yes, same base stats = boring. Variety is what we want, but don't pull away from theme. If a character has enough powers, represent one in their base stats (like a projectile with range or something).

Also, I love your idea for Levitation as a standard power Burny. We can use it on Dhalsim and M. Bison and such figures. How about this:

LEVITATION
When counting spaces for Dhalsim's movement, ignore elevations of levels up to Dhalsim's height. Dhalsim may Levitate over water without stopping, and over obstacles equal or less than his height. When Dhalsim starts to levitate, if he is engages he will take leaving engagement attacks.

[BurnyFlame]

Ryu - The name "TATSUMAKI SENPUU" usually ends with "Kyaku" for "Kick," correct? Is there a reason you chose to shorten it?

Guile - Glad to see we can work on him. I still think the name "Somersault Kick" is better, because that is what he does (a flip), what he says (at least in some games), and what I checked it was called in his move list. "Flash Kick" makes me think of a kick which has energy (like lightning), but not a flip kick.

Also, I like the Levitation idea. Has that power name been used on any other customs you know?

Both - For points, I don't think either of these characters are in the 150 point range. For instance, Shiori, at 60 points, has a Special Attack very similar to Ryu's, and she also has more movement and disengage. So it does not seem that 2 extra life and a weakened Whirlwind assault is worth 90 points. The same applies for Guile, most of the time he will only be attacking once with 3 attack dice -- not the best use of an order marker.

A few ways to address this:
1) Give all Street Fighters the "SF" symbol, indicating Stealth Leap, Disengage, Blocking, whatever we want.
2) Have multiple versions of the cards. If only two, then one at least comparable to Marvel figures (since they do fight them occasionally).
3) Simply keep these guys in the 90-120 point range.
4) Give these guys an extra power. Ryu Shoryuken and Guile some kind of Soldier boost.

[johnny139]

I feel like we could beef up the Street Fighters a bit - make Ryu 4/5 instead of 3/4 or something alone those lines.

A third power for some figures, based more on character than moves, would be nice in some cases.

[Scapemage]

Guile has a special move that is just as popular as Sonic Boom. It's called Flash Kick, and it is a flip-kick with energy.

I do not think that I have ever seen a power called Levitation before.

I don't think we should give everyone a symbol that represents disengage and stealth leap and such. That is overly-complicated IMO, and does every fighter actually have those powers? I also think that making 2 versions of each character would be too much. We can easily fit each character's key points onto one design.

[qt.bangerang]

I agree that they could be beefed up a bit and if we want to do a second version of some figures with multiple sculpts I think they should be done after everything is complete.

As for Guile and Flash Kick (and it is a flip-kick with energy) this matches the actual miniature.

For points I think that we need to have a goal range then play test them to see if they are worth more or less then the intended amount. Also, when it comes to points I don't think they should all be "A" units some should fall into the "B" and "C" ranges as well.

[Scapemage]

Originally Posted by qt.bangerang

I agree that they could be beefed up a bit and if we want to do a second version of some figures with multiple sculpts I think they should be done after everything is complete.

As for Guile and Flash Kick (and it is a flip-kick with energy) this matches the actual miniature.

For points I think that we need to have a goal range then play test them to see if they are worth more or less then the intended amount. Also, when it comes to points I don't think they should all be "A" units some should fall into the "B" and "C" ranges as well.

I believe that when we are designing, it's best to completely ignore where we want them to fall points wise and power rankings wise, and let playtesting figure that out for us.

[BurnyFlame]

I had an idea. Noting that Ryu can take multiple unibeams from Iron Man in a certain video game, I think that one way we can make these figures competitive with Marvel and classic HeroScape is to give them a lot more Life.

Reasons:
1) The Street Fighters are known for getting hit many times and getting up again.
2) It would allow them to have a chance to get to Melee combat (be more competitive).
3) Very thematic since they all do have large "Life Bars" in their games.
4) It can bring their point value up to where we want without changing their attack stats and powers.
5) As noted, they can in their games take multiple Marvel hits and keep going. Even the biggest hits (I'd say about 5 skulls equivalent in HeroScape) take only 5/8 of their health in the video games.

Therefore, I believe we should try to average about 8 Life for each figure, with a range of 6-10 Life. I believe Ryu and Guile should each have 8 Life. What do you think?