The Book of Cyclops (Utopian)

[Lazy Orang]

Originally Posted by Yodaking

And I'd like you to stop trying to give every human 5 or 6 life and then throwing a fit when we say no. Dragging your personal war against 4 life humans into every single thread does not win you any points for your arguments.

I don't try to 'give every Human 5 Life', and I have never tried to give a Human 6 Life (in fact, I'm generally against 6 Life Humans unless there's a good reason). Nor do I mention it on threads where it isn't relevant. Nor am I remotely against 4 Life Humans - I think it makes for a fine baseline, my issue only occurs when it's treated as a hard and fast rule. I'd like you to stop misrepresenting my arguments to score points.

[Arkham]

Maybe this conversation is best served elsewhere in sanctum. Not really needed in this thread.

[MrNobody]

I do think there’s a bit of a weird precedent where Batman, who is basically as tough as a human could possibly be, is at 4 life. It does feel weird to think that Cyclops (or any 5-life normal human) could take more of a beating than Batman. But at a certain level I get that it’s a game and you have to make accomodations for that.
Edit- Sorry, didn’t mean to drag an argument on if people feel this isn’t the right place.

[Scapemage]

Punisher is an excellent example of someone who just keeps going after getting beat. Batman and Daredevil are also examples of this, but they don't all run in at the same life value. Then again, these designs are all among the earliest from C3G, when things were a lot less consistent than they are now. In terms of this design, I'm not familiar with the time period this Cyclops is representing, but if he is not shown as more resilient, he should have the same life as Cyclops I in my opinion. Largely, it's a small change, so all is well either way.

[IAmBatman]

We're not perfect at staying consistent with things. In general I prefer non-enhanced Humans at 4 Life (less if they are somehow unwell/less than physical peak). Sometimes doing so would make a design come in too weak.

That said, Punisher generally is mentioned as one of the designs most in need of reevaluation for power level, so there's a universe where it might make sense to pull him back to 4 Life.

Since it was mentioned, I'd actually love to see this go 4 Life for the sake of consistency with the other Cyclops, but I wouldn't lose any sleep over it either way.

[Arkham]

I'm fine with whatever, I'd just hate to see a design centered around being the leader and hub for the army get killed too easily or be unreliable due to vulnerability. Do we have an idea on what type of damage Cyclops can usually withstand?

[IAmBatman]

Nope. But there are certainly some X-Men you can pair him with to help him defensively (or just lock down enemy figures to keep him clean). Angel, Shadowcat, Blob, etc.

[japes]

Originally Posted by Arkham

I'm fine with whatever, I'd just hate to see a design centered around being the leader and hub for the army get killed too easily or be unreliable due to vulnerability. Do we have an idea on what type of damage Cyclops can usually withstand?

No clue which is why I'd not commented on that. I'd always assumed probably that he had some type of healing considering he's get to scorch his own face off...plus he's bound to be more durable here than he was as a non battle hardened late teen early 20's figure...which is what the first Cyclops was.


Overall I'm not concerned with either direction here.

[japes]

Originally Posted by IAmBatman

Nope. But there are certainly some X-Men you can pair him with to help him defensively (or just lock down enemy figures to keep him clean). Angel, Shadowcat, Blob, etc.

Jean Grey.

[IAmBatman]

That too.

[Yodaking]

I'm generally more lenient on 'leader' type figures having a little extra life since they are lynch pit units with a big target on their backs. At least when I started up my personal G.I. Joe project that is how I set the standards for my own units. Rank and file would have 4 life, leaders get 5, with some exceptions made. If the first Cyclopes card represents his role of field commander of the X-Men, under the tutelage of Prof. X who was their leader, and this card represents him a decade later when he's left from under the wing of Prof. X and become a leader of mutant kind in his own right, then I don't have an issue with the life evolving up from 4 to 5 between those two cards. Plus we aren't talking about a standard human here, we are talking about a mutant and they seems to have their own set of standards in the comics.

Spoiler Alert!

Prof. X having just 4 life while being a leader also doesn't bother me, he's a cripple in a wheelchair after all and not someone I've ever seen working out in the gym or anything. His power has always been based on the strength of his mind, not his physical prowess. If he wasn't a leader and instead just some back ground or side character I would have argued for giving him 3 life. I'm actually a bit surprised Oracle ended up with 4 life, but I wasn't there for that discussion and she was Batgirl first so she did have a higher physical constitution to begin with before the accident put her in the chair. Plus her bio says she mastered Martial Arts after the accident so she clearly was working out physically post chair. So I'm ultimately okay with that decision on her life.

[IAmBatman]

That's true. He's NOT a Human ....