If MacDirk warriors were a Unique squad...

[philowar]

We want to use the MacDirk Warriors as a unique squad if that would mean substantially reducing their point cost. They are at 80 points now. How much would they drop in points if they were unique? 10 points? 20?

For that matter, on average about how much "undercosted" are unique squads as opposed to commons? I mean, if the Samurai or Tarn Vikings were common they would cost a little more?

[rehlers]

I believe that usually the unique armies cost more than the commons, as they have special abilities that make them powerful enough to stand on their own and thus worth picking. You can play with the macdirks with only 1 set of them, I was actually surprised that they were not a unique squad, as they can be very powerful when teamed up with Allistar.

[Eclipse]

Originally Posted by rehlers

I believe that usually the unique armies cost more than the commons, as they have special abilities that make them powerful enough to stand on their own and thus worth picking. You can play with the macdirks with only 1 set of them, I was actually surprised that they were not a unique squad, as they can be very powerful when teamed up with Allistar.

Unique armies are usually substantially cheaper than a similar common squad. The ability to take casualties without losing effectiveness is a bonus that gets added into their cost. Unique squads usually have superior abilities and end up costing more, but points/effectiveness they actually are priced cheaper.

[Ketch]

Originally Posted by philowar

We want to use the MacDirk Warriors as a unique squad if that would mean substantially reducing their point cost. They are at 80 points now. How much would they drop in points if they were unique? 10 points? 20?

For that matter, on average about how much "undercosted" are unique squads as opposed to commons? I mean, if the Samurai or Tarn Vikings were common they would cost a little more?

Unique squads aren't undercosted usually, using the same terminology as you, they are overpowered and generally the same price.

IMO, I'd say unique MacDirks would be 60 about. They aren't much more useful as commons,

They are incredibly powerful with MacDirk or another similar warrior, and I almost always just use one squad because their usefulness dies with the hero.

[philowar]

Thanks for the replies. I was thinking 60-70 myself. I asked because of some house rules we have going on that might make the MacDirks more draftable. As it is, they've been collecting dust for months. No one ever wants to use them because they're near useless without MacDirk and not worth spending 80 points on. I figured if we lowered their cost they'd get drafted more often, the trade-off being that they'd be a unique squad, thus limiting their power.

[Sargent_Drake_8]

I've never actually been able to locate another pack of macdirkians, seeing as the current wave 3 drought (I know their coming soon) shows no sign of stopping, but I think that they're still able to fulfill their 80 point value when used correctly. Here's one idea that only uses a single squad that I'm toying with.

Alastir Macdirk
Macdirk Warriorsx1
Thorogrim
Saylind
Marro warriors
400 points

The strategy behind this is to send thorogrim in first, and when he dies, place him on the macdirks. Next, send out alastir, but don't leave the macdirks far behind.when he gets pretty banged up, pull him back using saylind (hopefully onto a glyph) and rush the Macdirkians in for the kill. Four attacks of 8 dice each can hurt pretty bad. After that, the marro are there for mop up duty. saylind may seem to not be needed, but she has plenty of uses, so its not like she'll be wasted. I think a better army might be to sub out thorogrim for another squad of Macdirkians, but that kinda defeats the point of the "unique" thing.

[rehlers]

Thorgrim or Finn cannot be placed on the MacDirk warriors, they can only modify unique army cards.

[kenjib]

Originally Posted by philowar

For that matter, on average about how much "undercosted" are unique squads as opposed to commons? I mean, if the Samurai or Tarn Vikings were common they would cost a little more?

I think it is pretty case-specific. Some units like the tarns would be great as commons and not a huge price gap and the Zettian Guards might not need only a very slight adjustment if any at all. The Marro Warriors, on the other hand, would need a major price adjustment if made into commons and would even need their abilities reworded a bit to make sense.

[Sargent_Drake_8]

Originally Posted by rehlers

Thorgrim or Finn cannot be placed on the MacDirk warriors, they can only modify unique army cards.

Again, We're going on the assumption that we're making theses guys unique for the purpose of house rules

[ASmiles]

I think a good example for cost comparison is the Knights vs the Tarn Vikings.

Both are squads of 4 figures with indentical range, move, attack and defense stats. Knights cost 70. Vikings cost 50.

So for an extra 20 points, you lose the Beserker Charge, but gain common status, Human Champion Bonding and Coward's Reward.

If you assume that coward's reward and beserker charge are roughly equal, I'd guesstimate that 10 points is solely the bonding power and the other 10 points is the common status.

[Ketch]

Originally Posted by philowar

Thanks for the replies. I was thinking 60-70 myself. I asked because of some house rules we have going on that might make the MacDirks more draftable. As it is, they've been collecting dust for months. No one ever wants to use them because they're near useless without MacDirk and not worth spending 80 points on. I figured if we lowered their cost they'd get drafted more often, the trade-off being that they'd be a unique squad, thus limiting their power.

You can use them with other Human champions though,
Try it sometime, MacDirk/MacDirk warriors won the tournament here last year.
They work almsot as well with any other high life champion

[Eclipse]

Originally Posted by ASmiles

I think a good example for cost comparison is the Knights vs the Tarn Vikings.

Both are squads of 4 figures with indentical range, move, attack and defense stats. Knights cost 70. Vikings cost 50.

So for an extra 20 points, you lose the Beserker Charge, but gain common status, Human Champion Bonding and Coward's Reward.

If you assume that coward's reward and beserker charge are roughly equal, I'd guesstimate that 10 points is solely the bonding power and the other 10 points is the common status.

Maybe Human Champion Bonding, but there's no way Coward's Reward is equal to Berserker Charge.