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#49
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Re: Next Colorado Event: Saturday, January 16th, Boulder Lib
All those maps look good to me. It occurs to me that not everyone may know what the formats are, so below are the descriptions I copied from the Albuquerque NHSD set-up.
As for a 4th Kill 'em all map... how about we turn one HOB map into a Kill e'm all map? Technically, they're both Kill 'em all, afterall. Another thought might be that we bring one map for each format, then let all other maps come from the map building contest... One suggestion with regard to formats is that, instead of using the "Supreme Leader" Card in There Can Be Only One! that we get to choose a unique hero on our team to represent a general that our opponents would have to kill in order to win-- it would be more a "Kill the General" game, which is something I've played before with friends. Then we wouldn't have to worry about introducing a whole new type of figure into the game. Another suggestion is that for the Escape! format, we let each player use their full 750 point alotment of figures, since we're liable to only have one map of that sort. For formats that will have multiple maps, we should definitely consider having some for small armies and some for large armies. Anyway, just some thoughts. See below for descriptions of the formats... ********** 1. Standard HS tournament scenario. -Destroy all of your opponent's figures. Standard HS Scoring will be used if time runs out. (in our case, we're using Rolling Rumble format, so no time limits) 2. There Can Be Only One! -Each player has a Supreme Leader that they must protect. First player to destroy the opponent's Supreme Leader wins. Players will be provided with a Supreme Leader figure and card for this scenario. -Supreme Leader Card: 3. Heat of Battle. -There are no starting zones; players will take turns placing one card's worth of units anywhere on the battlefield except on glyphs. Figures cannot be placed adjacent to any enemy figures while there are spaces available that are not adjacent to enemy figures. Destroy all of your opponent's figures. Standard HS Scoring will be used if time runs out. 4. Capture the Flag. -Each player will have a Brandar Glyph to defend just outside of their start zone, and can win by ending a turn with one of their figures un-engaged and on the opponent's Glyph. Player's can move their figures onto their own glyph to defend it. 5. Escape! -Players are to trying exit as many of their figures off of the opponent's starting zone as possible. It takes 1 Move to exit from an outside space located in the Opponent's starting zone. Victory Points are based on full cards of figures exited off the board and full cards of destroyed enemy figures. The game ends when either the time runs out or when one player has no figures remaining on the board. The player with the highest Victory Points at the end of the game wins. |
#50
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Re: Next Colorado Event: Saturday, January 16th, Boulder Lib
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One thing worth noting is that the Supreme Leader's personality sort of screws 4th Mass and Sacred Band armies. Quote:
I'm sort of torn on what kind of map would be most fun for "Escape!" I'm pretty sure I'd hate playing it on a map like "Just Passing Through", where keeping figures out of your zone is ridiculously hard. I think my inclination would be to play it on a map like "Separation Anxiety", where there is an opportunity both for an agressive escaping strategy, and a more traditional killing strategy. At the far extreme would be a map like "Marr Highway", where the "Escape!" rules would be almost an afterthought for most figures. Quote:
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#51
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Re: Next Colorado Event: Saturday, January 16th, Boulder Lib
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As for using the full 750 point army-- I don't mind if one map goes without counter-drafting. Though it occurs to me that requiring 750 point armies with this format would discourage folks from using the Marro Hive, a unit which wouldn't work for obvious reasons. So perhaps the maximum possible army size for Escape! should be 590 points to avoid that situation. Here's a side thought-- instead of assigning army sizes to maps ahead of time, we might let the players roll a 20-sider at the beginning of their game: roll 1-4 = 300 points; roll 5-10 = 450 points; roll 10-15 = 520 points roll 16-19 = 650 points; roll 20 = 750 points. Quote:
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#52
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Re: Next Colorado Event: Saturday, January 16th, Boulder Lib
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This seems like a neat idea to me, although I do sort of like the TCBOO Supreme Leader, too. (Now that you mention it... if we only have a couple TCBOO games, maybe we can use kings in stead of pawns for the supreme leaders? You know, just 'cause.) My point wasn't that having Charos as your "supreme leader" is such a bad thing - just that that's where your first rule idea would lead people. Another solution to the Supreme Leader problem occurred to me - we could make the leader's personality "adaptable", and add a power "adaptable personality" that says the leader's personality may be chosen by the player at the beginning of the game. Simple enough. Quote:
Now that you mention this, though, it makes me thing that I'd be more inclined to go the other way in Escape - put nice jungle cover or high points on the map that tempt players to camp, only their opponent can foil the strategy by avoiding the entrenched position and escaping the map. Quote:
590 works fine by me, though, so I don't think we really disagree here. Quote:
Still, one thing I like here is that you're (implicitly) suggesting only 5 different point levels. I think this is a good idea. Players shouldn't have to plan for 12 different point levels - we'll just end up with lots of filler units in every army, which is sort of lame. (Unless we want to allow partial common squad drafting.) Quote:
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#53
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Re: Next Colorado Event: Saturday, January 16th, Boulder Lib
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One reason I proposed 80 point (or cheaper) Heroes was because I figured most armies would probably already have a Hero within that price range. Raelin could be commonly fielded, and I figure she's a natural since she's a big target, anyway. I don't mind people choosing figures like Charos, but I think your point that it might unduly influence army composition is a good one-- 80 points is easy to work with in just about any army pool. Quote:
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I do like the idea of lava maps for HOB. A map with islands and lots of water might be interesting, too. But, you know, I'd like to give both HOB maps to the winner and runner-up of the Map Building Contest-- I think it's nice for folks to get their own maps into the tournament some how. Quote:
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Okay, in other news, how do you think the different formats will play lenghtwise? If I were to rank the formats from fastest to slowest, this is how I would rank them: 1) Capture the Flag 2) HOB 3) Supreme Leader/Kill the General 4) Escape! 5) Kill 'em all I bring this up because we should probably consider it when determining army sizes and map construction. I would think we'd want to lean toward larger armies or slower maps for those formats higher on the list and smaller armies or faster maps for those formats lower on the list. What do you think? Last edited by Elginb; December 3rd, 2009 at 02:42 PM. |
#54
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Re: Next Colorado Event: Saturday, January 16th, Boulder Lib
the only army that would really be hurt by the supreme leaders personality is the 4th mass army. Disciplined armies can use parmenio to change the supreme leaders personality if need be. The 4th mass is already one of, if not the most powerfull squad in Heroscape. It is ridiculous to even thing about changing the supreme leaders personality just to make the 4th mass more powerfull than it already is. I don't think one way or the other about using the supreme leader, but if he is used, his personality should not be adaptibale. it would be differnt if by changing it, it helped out a weak figure, but why on earth would you think it needs to be changed to help an already over powered unit? Just make sure that everyone knows that in that scenario that the 4th mass won't get that bonus.
I will see what I can do about making it to this event, since I won't be able to go to the other event on my Birthday . I don't see it happening though because that would be 2 saturdays in a row I would miss my normal job, without having any vacation time. On the other hand, I'm pretty sure I will be able to attend in March. I'm still having my tuesday night events, but I have not had a decent attendance yet. |
#55
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Re: Next Colorado Event: Saturday, January 16th, Boulder Lib
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One other option would be to provide a hero for that format. So, say, everyone gets a Kyntela for that battle, and it's "kill the princess". If the hero is from your army, then that's going to influence army selection, no matter what the point cutoff is. Quote:
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If our game last time had been "Escape!", you might have just tried to fly around the edges... which would have forced me to leave Raelin's aura to engage, which would have opened my figures up to attack... it would have played differently, don't you think? Or imagine trying to beat Seth's Charos/Cyprien/Kyrie army in Escape... he's probably just going to fly by and get out of town. Taking that strategy to its extreme, a Hulk+Silver Surfer could be almost unbeatable in Escape. Quote:
I'd say something like... 590 555 520 460 400 I just started with 590, 520, and 400, and put another level halfway between each. I'm open to another set of 5, but that seems like a nice one that allows for a lot of variation and counter-drafting. Quote:
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1) Escape! 2) HoB 3a) Kill the General 3b) Supreme Leader 4) Capture the Flag 5) Kill 'em All Armies with a lot of speed or high-point heroes can end an Escape game really quickly just by getting off the board. HoB is pretty quick, of course. Kill the General depends on the General, of course, but plenty of figures are vulnerable to assasination. The Supreme Leader is relatively tough. CTF is sort of like supreme leader, except you can put another figure on the glyph if the one holding it dies. Quote:
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#56
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Re: Next Colorado Event: Saturday, January 16th, Boulder Lib
1) I guess I've just played the version where you pick your own general before, and I know it's a fun way to play. There's a wide variety of heroes to choose from and a wide variety of armies to build around your chosen general. If you have a strong objection to playing that format, then we shouldn't do it. But otherwise, is it okay if we go ahead with the pick-your-own-general/kill-the-general format?
2) I'm not married to using a lava map for "Escape!" and it sounds like you have a strong preference for a different kind of map-- no problem. Now, are there any maps that have start-zones with fewer start-zone spaces on the edges? 3) Army Sizes: I'd like to see more extreme point variation and maybe only 4 army sizes; something like: 600, 520, 450, 380-- Those size armies are guaranteed to play differently. I pick 380 as the low size, just because it allows someone to exclude the Hulk if he's in their 750 point pool; also, the 590 point limit I suggested earlier was only for "Escape!"-- otherwise, I'm fine with using larger point values. That being said, I think that the majority of the maps should be 520 or 450. 4) I see what you mean about "Capture the Flag"-- I'm used to playing it where you can't put your figures on your own flag (maybe we should try it that way?). Still, with "Escape!", an army full of expensive heroes might have an advantage (though I'm not convinced of that-- they activate more slowly and get killed by squads quicker than they kill them, in general), it certainly wouldn't be an advantage when playing kill 'em all games, so it balances out from an overall tournament perspective (even with a 750 point pool). Personally, I'm more concerned right now that the Glad/Blast combo is one that would dominate in all these formats. For that reason, I think our map selection should include some maps that cause Glad/Blasts fits... |
#57
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Re: Next Colorado Event: Saturday, January 16th, Boulder Lib
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The one format that is bad for 'trons is heat of battle. Unless your opponent is really short on cards,the blasties can get engaged at the start, which breaks the synergy behind the build. |
#58
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Re: Next Colorado Event: Saturday, January 16th, Boulder Lib
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Or, what if we limited the number of spaces you could actually exit? We could designate some Glyphs of Brandar as the exit spots and allow you to sit on the one in your own start zone. So then it would be like "Capture the Flag", but with more flags. If we only have one "Escape!" map, I have enough Brandar Glyphs to put, say, four or five (or one, if we want to make it really tough) in each start zone. Quote:
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#59
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Re: Next Colorado Event: Saturday, January 16th, Boulder Lib
I think this map would make a particularly interesting Capture the Flag map (maybe for 520 point armies?). The split start zones would really add strategy to flag placement.
Can't See the Jungle… I think this one would be great for Kill the General (maybe 450 pts?). The choice between the two high grounds would make for interesting decision-making on where to move your General. Embattled Fen This is a map I really enjoy. I'd like to submit it as a Kill 'em all map (520 point armies?). It plays really fast, but it's really fun. Fire Isles |
#60
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Re: Next Colorado Event: Saturday, January 16th, Boulder Lib
It would be nice to have an ice map. This one could be good for a Kill 'em all format for 450 point armies.
Frozen Tempest Element: Snow Construction: 1 RotV MS, 1 TT, 1 RttFF Also, I didn't get a chance to play Swamp Helix by dok at the last tournament. I figure that would be a good Kill 'em all map (maybe 380 point armies?). Last edited by Elginb; December 9th, 2009 at 07:21 PM. |
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