The Book of Death Knights of Valkrill

[lefton4ya]

Originally Posted by aquamaniac27

Honestly; if "swamp water is water, but water is not swamp water" why is it not "Death Knights are knights, but knights are not Death Knights"? I'm just looking for an official answer.

NO MORE QUESTIONING THIS!
"Knights" does NOT equal "Death Knights"

As for you logic, the SOTM rulebook specifically states to treat swamp water as water for all special powers - had it not had that ruling then swamp water would not work for water powers regardless that it has water in the name of the terrain. Canadian dollars are not the same as U.S dollars, but a store may specifically say "we accept Canadian dollars as if it were american dollars" which is an exception but doesn't make them the same. Nerak the Glacian Swog Rider rider is not the same as a Swog Rider, and I could go on with examples but if you are still reading this and questioning the reason why "Knights" does NOT equal "Death Knights" you will never be satisfied.

[Shockma Ranyk]

Originally Posted by aquamaniac27

Honestly; if "swamp water is water, but water is not swamp water" why is it not "Death Knights are knights, but knights are not Death Knights"? I'm just looking for an official answer.

Originally Posted by spiteofthedice

Q. "Death Knight" = "Knight"?
. . . Please?
A. No. "Death Knights" do NOT benefit from "Knight" synergies. (Bad Scaper--You know better than that).

'Nuff said, bad Scaper.

[The Orange Mailman]

We play with 600 point armies. Here is an army that has been in play a couple of times now and has done well.

Death Knights x 3
Taelord
Sir Hawthorne
Tenth Regiment x 2

While Taelord remains overpriced, this army is pretty competitive. The strategy thus far has been to alternate turns with Tenth Regiment and Death Knights. In other armies involving Taelord, you have to take a turn with Taelord to move your pod forward, or to higher ground. Here, you can take a turn with the Death Knights, choosing at that time to either move Taelord's aura, or take a turn with Sir Hawthorne getting an additional attack.

I'm not a big fan of two figure squads, but their 5 defense helps them hold on. I used them on a map similar to Jungle Swamp Road as a screen to block the road. Then the Tenth Regiment had height advantage, Taelord's aura, and sometimes Wait Then Fire. That's four attacks of five.

I won that battle easily, mainly due to the fire power of the Tenth combined with Taelord's aura; but then played against someone else using that same army while I used this army:

Knights of Weston x 2
Thorgrim
Finn
Sergeant Alexander Drake (ROTV)
Wyrmlings (White x 1, Red x 1, Blue x 2, Black x 2)

This army is definitely weaker on range, but I used the Black Wyrmlings and Red Wyrmling on the Death Knights to try to bypass the high defense. The KOW I sort of stockpiled until the Tenth Regiment came within striking distance. An equal amount of Knights and Tenth Regiment were killed. Hawthorne was killed by me and Thorgrim and Finn were killed by him. It came down to a pumped up Drake (with Finn and Thorgrimm's spirits) hunting down Taelord and one Death Knight. Drake took them out with four lives to spare.

At the critical moment, my opponent was utilizing the Death Knights twice and Tenth Regiment once for his three turns. If he had reversed that, he may have taken out more of my KOW and perhaps won the battle. Perhaps keeping the KOW back beyond his range led him to believe he would have to move Taelord's aura forward.

Anyway, the Death Knights are worth a try.

[aquamaniac27]

Originally Posted by Shockma Ranyk

'Nuff said, bad Scaper.

Yes, but I wanted to know if there was a more official ruling, like that of the Glyph of Lodin only affecting initiative rolls [but no one plays that way anyway... ]

And I'm mongering, since I have no knights out side my lonely squad of PKs. As for actual DK's the ability to cut down an opponent's def by 2 combined with the Taelord's attack buff of 1, even the Izumi aren't a threat.

[MrWookiee]

Why can you target the Death Knights' capes. It's not like they die from it. Anyways, why is it so hard for people to understand that Knights DOES NOT EQUAL Death Knights. By the way, Death Knights work great against the Arrow Gruts and murder the Death Chasers, as they can defend their 4 attack and make them roll no defense. Plus, they bond with the Venoc Warlord. He is actually good if you're not using Order Markers on him.

[Fen_Hydra]

Originally Posted by MrWookiee

Why can you target the Death Knights' capes. It's not like they die from it.

Otherwise you could face them away, and say that the enemie's 4th Mass or other ranged squad can't see them except for the cape, which isn't a hit zone, so with the errata you can't just face them away from ranged figures and have them not be able to be targetted.

[Juniour]

How about this:

3x Death Knights - 180
Taelord (for bonding and the attack aura) - 360
Raelin (To protect Taelord) - 440
Zetacron (when all else fails, use the Big Blue BroBot) - 500

Simple enough, just use Raelin to protect Taelord who gives the Death Knights an extra attack die, and attack with the Death Knights.

[master4sword]

Originally Posted by Fen_Hydra

Otherwise you could face them away, and say that the enemie's 4th Mass or other ranged squad can't see them except for the cape, which isn't a hit zone, so with the errata you can't just face them away from ranged figures and have them not be able to be targetted.

I always interpreted "untargetable" cloaks/etc as only untargetable where they don't "overlap" the character; if a shot is cape only then it's not a good shot, but if the cape is dead center of the figure's back or something then the shot is good.

[MrWookiee]

Originally Posted by Juniour

How about this:

3x Death Knights - 180
Taelord (for bonding and the attack aura) - 360
Raelin (To protect Taelord) - 440
Zetacron (when all else fails, use the Big Blue BroBot) - 500

Simple enough, just use Raelin to protect Taelord who gives the Death Knights an extra attack die, and attack with the Death Knights.

If you wanted some kick-a** squads, you could pull both out for an attack of 3 and a defense of 7.

[Freezie]

I know I already posted the army in the Prerelease thread, but I finally got to try out my themed army of PKx3, DKx4, Hawthorne against my cousin playing an elf wizard army and it did surprisingly well. The PKs were able to take out Ulginesh about halfway through the game, and it went downhill for him from there. The Death Knights did well along with their friend Jerry, who thankfully never turned on me, although I think they needed a few more squads for survivability. The PK's fit quite well with these guys being able to tie up range and assasinate key figures while the Death Knights slowly advanced. Don't underestimate 5 Defense!

[aquamaniac27]

If when attacking with a DK, the def fig rolls 2 less dice, do the Venocs take an auto 2 wounds? :P I'm kidding.

Actually, DKs + Taelord + SOTM Raelin

DK's 3/6, taelord gets the extra dice, raelin can sweep squads with whirlwind at 4 attack, and with 6 clear sight space, more maneuverability. (By a little.)

And in my own defense, I paid no attention to any pre-D3 threads, or really, any D3 thread at all, once the figures were beginning to be revealed, so I had no idea of this giant argument before hand.

[Filthy the Clown]

Originally Posted by Juniour

How about this:

3x Death Knights - 180
Taelord (for bonding and the attack aura) - 360
Raelin (To protect Taelord) - 440
Zetacron (when all else fails, use the Big Blue BroBot) - 500

Simple enough, just use Raelin to protect Taelord who gives the Death Knights an extra attack die, and attack with the Death Knights.

That looks like a fun build, but you and your Knights, Juniour (says Filthy, who took a trouncing from Juniour's Knights of Weston in Florida Frenzy 3.0). Rather than leading with Knights, I would be tempted to set up a DK screen within Raelin's aura, then snipe away with the Raelin/Taelord-backed Zetacron. 7 defense knights really only need to fear auto-wounders, and Zeta can pick them off one at a time, or at least until your opponent gets close.

---

On a related note, I have been testing out some builds with Death Knights (btw, Phantom Knights make great proxies, as 1 of the sculpts is very close in size and shape to the DKs), and my favorite builds do not involve Taelord. Much like the Wolf Core (Werewolf Lord and 2 squads of Badru), I like employing the Death Core: Death Knights x3 and Dumutef x 4, at 280 points, 14 spaces); it just seems to have the best mix of knights and speedy reinforcements, while still allowing a generous point reserve (at least, in 500ish point totals) to add other units.

Death Core 280
Raelin v2 120
Krav 100
500 points, 18 spaces
~ The Krav are what is referred to as bait; send them out early to suck in your opponent's ranged units, or especially anti-range. I milk the Krav for all that I can, but once I lose 2, or the opponent has closed, I unleash the Dumutef and Knights, who are essentially mid-game clean up. Raelin v2 works twofold: 1) the Krav can spread out and still enjoy her D boost, and 2) put her on a hook, because she is worthy bait as well.

Death Core 280
Warden 816 90
Zettians 70
MW 50
490 points, 21 spaces
~I send the Zettians out first, both to draw in the enemy, snipe at pesky units, and plod towards any glyphs (perhaps a similar, albeit cheaper role to the KMA, above). Of course, one can lead with the Death Core as well (I love the movement boost that Warden grants the DGs)...Either way, you have two clean up options: Warden and the Marro. I find this one to be a fun build. An alternate build can be procured by substituting the infamous Sir Hawthorne for the Warden, which gives a good rat-clearing option. Personally, I don't like Hawthorne in the build, as he always seems to turn on me when everything is on the line. But, your mileage may vary.
Watch out for: Rats and Goblins

Brunak 110
Raelin 80
Death Core 280
Air Elemental 30
500 points, 18 spaces
~Although Raelin makes great bait, simply towing her along tends to change the role of this build: from a directed strike force to a slow-roll of death. Although this build does not completely adhere to logical criteria that Dok listed in regards to using the Brunak/Raelin combo, it just seems to fit. Brunak gives you a special attack and a Louisville Slugger for tough craniums, and the Dks and DG get amplified to massive defensive levels. The elemental is really just another bonding/filler option, but it can have it's uses, especially when facing a fast-moving melee force, such as Death Chasers. The best part? Only 2 locations for your OMs for hopefully the vast majority of the match.
Watch out for: Auto-wounders that bypass high-defense and Raelin.

Modified Death Core:
DK x3 180
DG x3 100
VW 120
Aubrien Archers x2
515 points, 19 spaces
(subconsciously inspired by AA-chatter, starting with Aldin's post in pre-release thread)
~I find this to be another fun build. Send out the archers early and aim for taking advantage of the Mittens-boosted frenzy rolls. If your opponent is employing wyrmlings, or other auto-wound units with lower defense, target them first. When the archers fall (why not suicide em??), send out the Mittens-backed core for an explosive melee smackdown.

Originally Posted by aquamaniac27

Actually, DKs + Taelord + SOTM Raelin

DK's 3/6, taelord gets the extra dice, raelin can sweep squads with whirlwind at 4 attack, and with 6 clear sight space, more maneuverability. (By a little.)
.

I like Raelin v2 with the DKs as well, although I find her more useful with the mobile Dumutef.