Heroscapers
Go Back   Heroscapers > Custom HeroScape Creations > Custom Units & Army Cards > C3V and SoV Customs
C3V and SoV Customs A place for C3V and SoV customs


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #6241  
Old April 15th, 2019, 04:47 PM
Scytale's Avatar
Scytale Scytale is offline
Thanksgiving Custom Contest Champion
 
Join Date: August 25, 2006
Location: USA - MN - Rochester
Posts: 8,596
Images: 457
Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth
Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Clayton Pierce has been withdrawn by the submitter.

This is the best version of Xundar and his shadows yet. Great change to the Fiend and I like that Xundar has good reason to try to use his special before running out of shadows.

to review Xundar
to review Shadow Binder
to review Shadow Fiend
to review Shadow Hound
Reply With Quote
  #6242  
Old April 15th, 2019, 08:11 PM
BiggaBullfrog's Avatar
BiggaBullfrog BiggaBullfrog is offline
 
Join Date: December 31, 2009
Location: Logan or SLC, Utah
Posts: 2,061
Images: 241
Blog Entries: 4
BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla
Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
This is the best version of Xundar and his shadows yet. Great change to the Fiend and I like that Xundar has good reason to try to use his special before running out of shadows.
Pretty much my feelings exactly. I could see this change potentially making Xundar more interactive with his army than other commanders.

to Shadowman and his groupies.
Reply With Quote
  #6243  
Old April 16th, 2019, 12:54 AM
Pumpkin_King's Avatar
Pumpkin_King Pumpkin_King is offline
A Happy Extradimensional Horror
 
Join Date: August 4, 2006
Location: VA-Culpeper
Posts: 6,686
Pumpkin_King is a penguin with a machine gun Pumpkin_King is a penguin with a machine gun Pumpkin_King is a penguin with a machine gun Pumpkin_King is a penguin with a machine gun Pumpkin_King is a penguin with a machine gun Pumpkin_King is a penguin with a machine gun Pumpkin_King is a penguin with a machine gun Pumpkin_King is a penguin with a machine gun Pumpkin_King is a penguin with a machine gun Pumpkin_King is a penguin with a machine gun Pumpkin_King is a penguin with a machine gun
Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

I've made a post in the pre-sov thread about Clayton Pierce. Linking it here so people can follow along.
Reply With Quote
  #6244  
Old April 16th, 2019, 03:19 PM
Scytale's Avatar
Scytale Scytale is offline
Thanksgiving Custom Contest Champion
 
Join Date: August 25, 2006
Location: USA - MN - Rochester
Posts: 8,596
Images: 457
Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth
Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Xundar (primary) has received 4 Yea votes to review (superfrog, capsocrates, Scytale, and BiggaBullfrog) and moves forward in the process.

Shadow Binder (secondary) has received 4 Yea votes to review (superfrog, capsocrates, Scytale, and BiggaBullfrog) and moves forward in the process.

Shadow Fiend (secondary) has received 4 Yea votes to review (superfrog, capsocrates, Scytale, and BiggaBullfrog) and moves forward in the process.

Shadow Hound (secondary) has received 4 Yea votes to review (superfrog, capsocrates, Scytale, and BiggaBullfrog) and moves forward in the process.
Reply With Quote
  #6245  
Old April 19th, 2019, 11:50 AM
Scytale's Avatar
Scytale Scytale is offline
Thanksgiving Custom Contest Champion
 
Join Date: August 25, 2006
Location: USA - MN - Rochester
Posts: 8,596
Images: 457
Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth
Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Soontir Van by @Arch-vile

I am always happy to see VC factions expanded. The Mariedians are a decent faction, but they have been wanting a leader to give them a boost for some time. I really like Mariedian Move Enhancement, which is different than simple Leadership in a good way. It plays well to the M-43s' handy Guerrilla Tactics in a clever, useful way that is different than other factions. I also appreciate the reuse of Exosuit, which is a nice throwback to fellow Mariedian hero Jarek Guy.

When I got Soontir and friends to the table though, something stood out to me almost immediately: Soontir's lower Defense stat. Defense in Heroscape is much more than simple armor; that much is obvious. It's impressive that the M-43s manage 3 Defense with just their street clothes (and that could arguably be the problem here). I'm guessing they're agile. Soontir only has 2 Defense, which isn't necessarily a bad thing for the design, and he does have Exosuit to boost it. But this Leader will almost always be played alongside M-43s, and he is much better armored than them. Like I said, Defense is more than just armor, but rolling less defense dice with Soontir than the M-43s just felt wrong on a basic level. After just a couple of games I knew I would never get past it, even though I liked everything else about Mr. Van.

With stats that reflect the mini a bit more I would be happy to give him another try. Even 3 Defense would feel a lot better.

I vote Nay to induct Soontir Van into the SoV.
Reply With Quote
  #6246  
Old April 19th, 2019, 11:53 AM
Scytale's Avatar
Scytale Scytale is offline
Thanksgiving Custom Contest Champion
 
Join Date: August 25, 2006
Location: USA - MN - Rochester
Posts: 8,596
Images: 457
Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth
Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Soontir Van by @Arch-vile has received two Nay votes to induct (superfrog and Scytale) and is removed from the process.
Reply With Quote
  #6247  
Old April 19th, 2019, 10:58 PM
Arch-vile's Avatar
Arch-vile Arch-vile is offline
 
Join Date: April 17, 2011
Location: USA - IL - Springfield
Posts: 10,506
Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth
Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Thanks for the reviews! I'll run some testing (superfrog suggested 3/3 defensive stats with 3 attack at 50 points, so I'll start there) and be back eventually.
Reply With Quote
  #6248  
Old April 22nd, 2019, 06:31 PM
Scytale's Avatar
Scytale Scytale is offline
Thanksgiving Custom Contest Champion
 
Join Date: August 25, 2006
Location: USA - MN - Rochester
Posts: 8,596
Images: 457
Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth
Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Spectres of Aldorn by @Leaf_It

We have ghosts in Heroscape already, but that doesn't mean I'm not interested in seeing another. Especially a common squad, as VC has plenty of heroes.

Balance

Attack of 2 isn't all that good, but Deathly Touch mitigates that to an extent. The Specters have good movement, especially with Phantom Walk and Levitate, plus medium defense. Overall that doesn't seem all that strong, but taking into account that they're a 4-figure common squad for only 50 points, they come out looking pretty good. Despite their relatively straightforward design it is difficult to make direct comparisons with existing units as the Specters have neither range nor bonding. A somewhat apt comparison is non-bonding Axegrinders, who have similar stats (with the bonus movement when not bonding). The Axegrinders' high base Attack is better than Deathly Touch, and their Fearless Advantage, though situational, is a solid boost. On top of that, they do have the potential to bond. So the Specters aren't, at least, obviously out of place at 50 points.

Theme

Phantom Walk and Levitate are natural fits for ghosts, though it's a bit odd that they don't have Flying. I can buy it well enough, though. Deathly Touch is both a useful ability and very fitting thematically. The Specters stats are well within expectations as well. The one thing I'm not fond of is the class of Harbingers. I guess it can work thematically if they are heralding the coming of something else, but that doesn't really work on the Heroscape battlefield. Harbingers could maybe work as a Heroscape class if they worked as shock troops for some powerful later-game unit, but there's nothing in the rest of the design to support that. They aren't even really a shock troop (though they can work that way), more of a bread-and-butter design. Vydar is a little unusual of a choice for Undead, but it's not the first time for him.

Creativity

There is excellent restraint shown here in the design which makes it come together well as a complete package. While the card has three powers, it really doesn't feel like it since Phantom Walk and Deathly Touch are so core to the design. Aside from my gripe about Harbingers, the rest of the unit feels like it all belongs together on a card.

Playability

The Specters of Aldorn work well as a core component of an army. Four figures, combined with Move 6 and two movement powers, gives them excellent board control despite lacking range or bonding. While Attack of 2 is weak, Deathly Touch is pretty easy to pull off, which helps more than you'd think.

Playing the Aldorians is pretty straightforward. Phantom Walk gives them all the freedom they need, so rush in, take the high ground, and attack away. The only somewhat challenging piece is Deathly Touch, but once they are in the fight a single Specter is often enough to Touch all the targets you plan to attack. The one thing to watch out for is to avoid overextending; it's generally better to hold off on rushing in until they can at least secure Deathly Touch instead of attacking figures at the edge of their threat range.

I tested the Harbingers quite a bit. At first I really liked how they played and how well the theme came through. But after a while I started to realize how difficult they were to defeat. Point for point they were consistently (as in, always) beating even top-class armies when the map favored them. Levitation feels like it's more a thematic power than useful, but it can make a huge difference in gameplay. It's common for lava maps, for example, to have lava fields as high ground. The Specters don't care and can park on all the good spots. Likewise they can ignore water, heavy snow, lava, and more. Mainly I saw them dominate on lava maps, but there are plenty of maps that favor them.

The Specters of Aldorn are not overwhelming by any means, and seem to be appropriately priced on maps that don't favor them. They aren't even overwhelming on maps that do favor them, but they are a top-class contender at least. I am not against passing a top-class unit, and the Specters are only borderline on the too-strong scale. If the design was different I might upvote them, but there is another issue at play here. The Specters don't really have any real weaknesses to speak of. Sure, as a melee unit they can struggle with range depending on the map (though the ability to pass through screens helps a lot there), and high-defense units can be hard to crack, but they have the movement and number of attacks per activation to make up for it. The Specters of Aldorn have all-around decent stats and powers that don't make them especially strong or weak against anything. That, by itself, is ok too, especially for a bread and butter unit. But a design without weaknesses that is also top class? That is concerning, and potentially bad for the game.

Summary

There is so much to like here. The stats, the theme, how they play, it (almost) all fits together nicely. And it's a common squad! But I think their power level is dangerously high. Their strength is at least somewhat map dependent, but they are really good on a lot of maps, and units need to be priced based on their strengths. I waffled quite a bit on my decision, but I think the Specters of Aldorn are just a bit too cheap for what they offer.

I vote Nay to induct the Specters of Aldorn into the SoV.
Reply With Quote
  #6249  
Old April 22nd, 2019, 06:34 PM
Scytale's Avatar
Scytale Scytale is offline
Thanksgiving Custom Contest Champion
 
Join Date: August 25, 2006
Location: USA - MN - Rochester
Posts: 8,596
Images: 457
Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth
Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

The Spectres of Aldorn have received two Nay votes to induct (superfrog and Scytale) and are removed from the process.
Reply With Quote
  #6250  
Old April 22nd, 2019, 08:08 PM
Leaf_It's Avatar
Leaf_It Leaf_It is offline
 
Join Date: February 19, 2008
Location: USA - Utah
Posts: 1,229
Images: 5
Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla Leaf_It is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla
Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

To make sure I'm understanding correctly, the sticking points are 50 Points, and Harbingers? So I should not be touching the other aspects of the design for any resubmissions?
Reply With Quote
  #6251  
Old April 22nd, 2019, 08:30 PM
Scytale's Avatar
Scytale Scytale is offline
Thanksgiving Custom Contest Champion
 
Join Date: August 25, 2006
Location: USA - MN - Rochester
Posts: 8,596
Images: 457
Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth Scytale is a man of the cloth
Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_It View Post
To make sure I'm understanding correctly, the sticking points are 50 Points, and Harbingers? So I should not be touching the other aspects of the design for any resubmissions?
I really liked pretty much everything about the Specters, except those two things. "Harbingers" doesn't seem to match the rest of the card, and the class doesn't translate to the battlefield either. 50 points is just a bit low. I'd suggest doing some mass Specters testing at 60 points against strong armies on lava, heavy snow, and water-heavy maps.
Reply With Quote
  #6252  
Old April 26th, 2019, 07:16 PM
Arch-vile's Avatar
Arch-vile Arch-vile is offline
 
Join Date: April 17, 2011
Location: USA - IL - Springfield
Posts: 10,506
Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth Arch-vile is a man of the cloth
Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

I'd like to nominate my updated Soontir Van to the SoV. I have taken the judges' feedback into account and after playtesting I am happy with this new version.



The miniature used is Sith Operative from Star Wars Miniatures (Knights of the Old Republic set). There are over 50 available between Troll & Toad, Game Hollow, and Miniature Market. It sells for less than $2.

He is now 50 points with 3 attack and has defensive stats of 3/3 instead of 4/2. He is never worth an order marker, but his lack of threat plus his Exosuit can keep him alive until the endgame where he can avenge his fallen allies if needed. Guerrilla Tactics keeps him involved in the game as a movement booster or just as an annoying blocker. The lower point cost helps Mariedian armies, as Soontir can more easily fit into various point totals.

I found the best army cores involved 3 squads of M-43, Soontir Van, and a strong hero like Cyprien or Quahon. Including other Mariedians is very fun (more enhanced movement opportunities) but is not quite as strong, IMO.

Thank you for your consideration,
Arch-vile
Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Heroscapers > Custom HeroScape Creations > Custom Units & Army Cards > C3V and SoV Customs
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:33 AM.

Heroscape background footer

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.