The Pre-SoV Workshop

[Kinseth]

Perhaps it should be one word, Skullcrusher. *Shrug*

Thanks on those Typos.

That is only 9 squad members, that total army is 12 figures. For the same point cost of 480, I don't think it is more powerful than say Heaviesx3, Grimnak, Nerak, Raelin, Marcu.

You are really underestimating the power of the Warband once the Warchief is dead. Who will be targeted by your enemy early and often because of what he brings to the table.

[Dysole]

Originally Posted by Kinseth

Perhaps it should be one word, Skullcrusher. *Shrug*

Thanks on those Typos.

That is only 9 squad members, that total army is 12 figures. For the same point cost of 480, I don't think it is more powerful than say Heaviesx3, Grimnak, Nerak, Raelin, Marcu.

You are really underestimating the power of the Warband once the Warchief is dead. Who will be targeted by your enemy early and often because of what he brings to the table.

Maybe. Same life and defense as Eltahale and Morgoloth who are also considered rather beastly. Yeah it's only 9 squaddies but I could argue dropping Gruul for another Warband. At 510 add Marro Warriors and that looks pretty dang scary. Is it broken? Difficult to say. I just don't recall gnolls being known for being beefy. I could be wrong.

~Dysole, who wouldn't know for sure without testing

[Kinseth]

Gnolls are hyena-headed, evil humanoids that wander in loose tribes. Most gnolls have dirty yellow or reddish-brown fur. A gnoll is a nocturnal carnivore, preferring intelligent creatures for food because they scream more. A gnoll is about 7-1/2 feet tall and weighs 300 pounds.


Maybe, once you lose Ragsh, there is no doubt about it. They lose their hardest hitting hero, and lose their ability to move and attack with one additional Gnoll squad.

With that in mind, you have to worry about sticking his neck out there unlike other bonding heroes.

There are many armies that can be pretty dang scary when adding Marro Warriors and Raelin to their arsenal, let's step back from the cliffs edge though please

[Dysole]

Originally Posted by Kinseth

Gnolls are hyena-headed, evil humanoids that wander in loose tribes. Most gnolls have dirty yellow or reddish-brown fur. A gnoll is a nocturnal carnivore, preferring intelligent creatures for food because they scream more. A gnoll is about 7-1/2 feet tall and weighs 300 pounds.


Maybe, once you lose Ragsh, there is no doubt about it. They lose their hardest hitting hero, and lose their ability to move and attack with one additional Gnoll squad.

With that in mind, you have to worry about sticking his neck out there unlike other bonding heroes.

There are many armies that can be pretty dang scary when adding Marro Warriors and Raelin to their arsenal, let's step back from the cliff though please

I'm not sure I have enough incentive to charge him into the fray when I can functionally have a 4 man squad and snipe with Gruul.

As for MW and Rae, when playtesting a unit I try to break it and so build its most powerful army. It's potent I grant you and I applaud you trying something like this. I think I'd be less concerned if their defense was 3 since 5/1/3/4 is quite solid. Comparable figures in that arena are PKs (more move+Stealth flight+Insubstantial-only 3 figures no bonding-10 points more expensive), HSBs (1 more attack consistently+Barge-only 3 figures no bonding-15 points more), Warforged (Autoshields+Tac Switch-only 3 figures no bonding-20 points more), KoB (1 extra figure+1 extra attack consistent-twice the cost), Anubian Wolves (potentially higher attack-only 3 figures no bonding-15 points more), and Quasatch Hunters (niche so irrelevant to discussion).

Anyways, they are beefy stats on a bonding unit. Are they worth it? Maybe. Anyways, I will say that I think I would play them more protecting my chief and possibly saving the chief for cleanup so that I don't lose the four squad bonus. Just some thoughts.

~Dysole, hoping that helps clarify

[Kinseth]

It is hard to compare Apples to Oranges, all of the units you mentioned have some unique aspect about them that you cannot quantify (Phantom Knights, HSB, KoB(not twice the cost), Warforged etc...) in the terms of point cost.

They can be compared to Knights/Heavies/Dwarves because they have similarities that can be compared Apples to Apples.

Everything tastes better with Bacon(Raelin), but you and me both know that there are many tests that go into playtesting that do not involve Raelin. If you took some similar armies , how would they fair?

If we draw up some similar armies based on Apples to Apples. Lets shoot for 460-480 point armies.

Gnolls
Warband x4(12 total figures)
Warcheif
Gruul Archer

Heavy Gruts
Heavies x4(16 total figures)
Nerak
Grimnak

Knights
KoW x4(16 total figures)
Sir Gilbert
Finn

Death Chasers
DCs x5 (15 figures)
Nerak
MBS
Ogre Pulverizer


Dreadguls x4 (12 Figures)
Guilty
Jotun

Those are armies we can compare apples to apples, and I am aiming for the gnolls to be slightly less powerful than Heavies/Knights.

They do have one hero that can "Snipe" but it isn't a long distance.

I'd be happy to playtest with anyone who wants to see them in action. I think they are fairly spot on for around a B+ power level. That is my goal in designing these guys.

[Scytale]

I am concerned about their power level, having done quite a bit of testing of my own gnolls. This version is strictly better for 10pts more per squad. While mine weren't A-rank, they have always been pretty solid. You're brushing dangerously close to too strong.

While it appears that Gnoll Bonding (which I strongly recommend you rename to Gnoll Hero Bonding) gives tactical decisions, I agree with Dysole that it really doesn't. The bonus from Warpath is too good to risk losing until at least midgame, especially while another bonding option is available. That isn't necessarily a bad thing, but recognize it for what it is.

[caps]

I don't see the thematic need for 4 defense on those common squad figures. Drop it to 3 and kill two birds with one stone (power level and theme fail).

[TheAverageFan]

I don't think Warpath is quite so potent since it effectively bumps each Squad's cost to 80, but 4 defense seems like a bit much, IMO. Especially when they can easily boost their Attack value as well.

~TAF,

[CrazyTankster]

The first thing I observed when I read the squad card was that the stats seemd a little high for the cost, especially with the bonding power and the other 2 powers on the card

[William099]

I'm back! Wanted to try Rampage again with some more tweaks. Hows the point value? And what do you guys do you think of having two defense base with minus two defense from Rage?

[Dysole]

"add two to Rampage's Move and Attack". You have "and two to Rampage's Move and Attack"

~Dysole, who would have to check other official wordings to make sure it's all right

[Scytale]

A cleaner, sharper design overall, with a nice reuse of existing powers. It feels a little odd at first to drop to 0 Defense, but I got past that quickly. It does make him feel like a Barbarian, even with Warforged Resolve. (Note: he still gets the extra shield from Warforged Resolve, even if he rolls zero defense dice.)