View Single Post
  #292  
Old May 3rd, 2021, 12:53 PM
dok's Avatar
dok dok is offline
GenCon Main Event Champion - 2010, 2011, & 2017
 
Join Date: October 9, 2008
Location: USA - CO - Denver
Posts: 23,206
Images: 110
Blog Entries: 17
dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth dok is a man of the cloth
Re: The Book of Demogorgon Stalker - Public Playtesting

tl;dr I think the upside down should be a full figure 8 so that you can more reliably run away from Demogorgons if they are not getting OMs. Maybe other things, but definitely that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Pyre View Post
I don't know, feels a bit cheesy yet. What's the issue with someone getting knocked out of it once they receive a wound, or have it on a timer? Overcomplicating this might just create more edge cases and issues. I'm just speaking from experience from Angstrom. It took a LOT of work to make him work, and we cut out all the alt reality battling on purpose because it was extremely cumbersome and intensive to tool.
I don't want to comment on complexity, because I think this is a really cool mechanic and if y'all want to roll with it I'm not one to stop you.

But purely from a balance perspective, I agree with LP. Angstrom was a favorite of mine when playing competitive C3G because sidelining an opponent's OM hub or key hero for a while could be so strong. The Demogorgon seems even better at this.

The huge caveat to the Demogorgon's power is that you need to score a wound on the opponent's figure before you can drag them. However, there are plenty of other ways to try to land a single wound while the Demo waits in the wings, and moreover the Deomogorgon itself can drop Hellicarrier-style right next to its target and attack it to set things up. On OM3 you can put the Demogorgon anywhere, and drop an attack. Then snatch on OM1. With a little luck your opponent doesn't even have a chance to respond. This seems like an easier prospect than using Angstrom, where I often had to pair him with Hawkeye2 in order to get him in dangerous positions.

And the actual banishment is far more harsh. With Angstrom I didn't need to invest OMs in a trapped figure to get them out; I just had to roll and hope. It usually took about a round, and did about a wound. With the Upside Down, you can place the Demo 5 spaces from the portal with the opponent stuck on the far side of it. Due to the layout, non-flying figures have to use turns to kill the Demogorgon to get by, they are taking autowounds the whole time, and once the Demogorgon is dead it's still two turns to move out for many figures. That's often a death sentence because you can't afford to invest that many OMs, even if they could make it out theoretically.

Basically, rather than seeing the Demogorgon as part of a Tormentor build, I see it as a utility piece that allows me disruption of the opponent's army by snatching a key hero. Once it does the deed I just leave it there, pinning the enemy hero in the very back of the upside down. Rinse and repeat after that figure dies, if needed.

Some thoughts I have on possible adjustments:
  • Adjust the Upside-down layout. Make it a full figure 8 so that a walking figure can run away from an inactive Demogorgon to get to the portal, instead of trying to kill the Demogorgon. This seems pretty thematic and it solves some of the bigger issues.
  • The Portal allowing you to place into engagement seems worrying, particularly since it also allows you to attack that turn. I might change one or the other of those two things (i.e. either placement can't be adjacent to other figures, or portal use is at the end of the turn). I'm less confident in these suggestions because this makes the Demogorgon a lot weaker in general, not just when it's being used in a degenerate way to sideline key heroes.
Reply With Quote