Heroscapers

Heroscapers (https://www.heroscapers.com/community/index.php)
-   C3G Library (https://www.heroscapers.com/community/forumdisplay.php?f=167)
-   -   The Book of C3G Destructible Object Rules (https://www.heroscapers.com/community/showthread.php?t=55039)

Yodaking October 1st, 2019 05:08 PM

Re: The Book of Vehicle Rules - Final Editing
 
Wide not long. Ghostrider already rocks a single hex cycle. The Lawmaster is more beefy in nature though so that could end up being a double base. A full sized car (van, pickup, etc.) really should take up a 2x2 (or 2x4, or 2x6) hex space instead of a 1x2 hex space though, then you could create a map with a single hex wide ally between two buildings and a motorcycle could go through it just a van could not. That's all I was saying. That ship sailed long ago due to ease of movement rules (I'm guessing, I wasn't there when the decision was made to use official cars that are out of scale).

So now we need to make sure there are other things that make it advantageous to draft a motorcycle over a car since the enclosed car doubles as armor and the exposed motorcycle does not. I'd also imagine the cycle has less life and the minimal space for passengers are additional knocks. So higher speed, cheaper price are two things to help off set the negatives. Maybe let cycles jump over water tiles without stopping, when driving into water with a car water clogs the engine and shuts the car down for the rest of the game? That would be a cool feature that makes the Batcycle more appealing than the Batmobile on certain maps.

Tornado October 1st, 2019 06:27 PM

Re: The Book of Vehicle Rules - Final Editing
 
The Lawmaster is beefy. I could not see it as anything but double space.
It does offer some protection, at least when in pursuit.
It is also AI which is pretty.unique.
It does have a Leap power as well.

IAmBatman October 1st, 2019 07:55 PM

Re: The Book of Vehicle Rules - Final Editing
 
This seems like the concern of future units, though, not this rules set.

A3n October 1st, 2019 09:52 PM

Re: The Book of Vehicle Rules - Final Editing
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by quozl (Post 2319247)
That would make it so you couldn't shoot someone on a motorcycle unless you saw the handlebars.

This prompted the thoughts in my head about attacking.
  • Can a figure attack from a vehicle?
  • Can a vehicle have an attack (e.g. mounted machine guns)?
  • Where is sighting point from a full covered vehicle?
  • Also if a vehicle has "openings" that allow for clear sight on the rear of the vehicle how should this be demonstrated in the target icon?
These questions would apply to non-draftable & draftable VDOs alike.

Specific things about motorcycles jumping & what not I would say are specific to the card for that vehicle. But Cover & Attacking is definitely an issue for this ruleset.

I was thinking that an icon could be used for partial cover & full cover & no icon for no additional cover (if that is a thing). But I'm fine to stay with wordage in the left panel (that's actually easier for me as I don't have to come up with the icons ;)).


Quote:

Originally Posted by IAmBatman (Post 2207184)
OCCUPYING VEHICLES
...
Figures on a VDO Army Card may move between the passenger and driver spaces normally, at the cost of one space of movement.

So are we supposed to have passenger spaces also on the card? This was discussed way back when Grey Owl was here & he designed an extended card that added specific spots for drivers & passengers. I think we were all against that in the end & I think that was one of the reasons why the full rules were dropped way back then.

IAmBatman October 1st, 2019 10:00 PM

Re: The Book of Vehicle Rules - Final Editing
 
1. Figures in partial cover vehicles trace range and LOS, including for ranged attacks, through the target point on the vehicle. Since figures inside vehicles can never be engaged with figures outside vehicles, they can't melee attack through vehicles, only ranged.

2. A vehicle can have an attack if we put an attack on a vehicle card. That special power will specify how it works. I've seen write ups for this kind of thing from Tornado already.

3. You're not able to perform a ranged attack through a full cover vehicle unless you have a power that allows you to attack without clear sight, in which case target points don't matter.

4. There would have to be target areas on the front and the back in that case.

On most cards the "passenger spaces" are just the card itself and only the driver space is specifically designated on the card. There may be future cards that have special spaces, like a "gunner seat" or something. But we'll tackle those when we get there.

Fwiw: I imagine target points for vehicles not to be little green dots, but to cover entire windows and so forth.

A3n October 1st, 2019 11:26 PM

Re: The Book of Vehicle Rules - Final Editing
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by IAmBatman (Post 2319422)
4. There would have to be target areas on the front and the back in that case.
...
Fwiw: I imagine target points for vehicles not to be little green dots, but to cover entire windows and so forth.

I figured that, but how do we show that in the target icon? In nearly all instances you won't be able to see the back in the target icon view. ???

A3n October 2nd, 2019 01:32 AM

Re: The Book of Vehicle Rules - Final Editing
 
Ok here's my first idea for the card. A Helm wheel for the designated driver:

SNIP

Notice the target icon & how you wouldn't be able to see the rear window to add it as a sight to shoot from?

IAmBatman October 2nd, 2019 12:40 PM

Re: The Book of Vehicle Rules - Final Editing
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by A3n (Post 2319433)
Quote:

Originally Posted by IAmBatman (Post 2319422)
4. There would have to be target areas on the front and the back in that case.
...
Fwiw: I imagine target points for vehicles not to be little green dots, but to cover entire windows and so forth.

I figured that, but how do we show that in the target icon? In nearly all instances you won't be able to see the back in the target icon view. ???

Yeah, I understand that, but you don't see the front and back of figure icons either. I think we more or less have to just assume the 360 degree interpretation for things like that. Like if it's a spot on the car you can shoot from the front of, you can shoot from the back as well.

With any standard vehicle with windows, I think it'll be fairly intuitive in practice as well.

Also, card looks awesome! :-) I'm a tad iffy on how nautical the wheel looks there. Anyway we can keep it distinctive but make it look a tad more modern?

Yodaking October 2nd, 2019 01:00 PM

Re: The Book of Vehicle Rules - Final Editing
 
Car steering wheel?

Lazy Orang October 2nd, 2019 04:09 PM

Re: The Book of Vehicle Rules - Final Editing
 
That being said, could you send me the graphic for the nautical one in a PM, please. :)

IAmBatman October 2nd, 2019 05:52 PM

Re: The Book of Vehicle Rules - Final Editing
 
Something more like this, maybe?

https://cdn5.vectorstock.com/i/1000x...r-22143109.jpg

A3n October 2nd, 2019 08:16 PM

Re: The Book of Vehicle Rules - Final Editing
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by IAmBatman (Post 2319553)
Quote:

Originally Posted by A3n (Post 2319433)
Quote:

Originally Posted by IAmBatman (Post 2319422)
4. There would have to be target areas on the front and the back in that case.
...
Fwiw: I imagine target points for vehicles not to be little green dots, but to cover entire windows and so forth.

I figured that, but how do we show that in the target icon? In nearly all instances you won't be able to see the back in the target icon view. ???

Yeah, I understand that, but you don't see the front and back of figure icons either. I think we more or less have to just assume the 360 degree interpretation for things like that. Like if it's a spot on the car you can shoot from the front of, you can shoot from the back as well.

With any standard vehicle with windows, I think it'll be fairly intuitive in practice as well.

We don't do the back of figures because the rules don't require that a figure can sight through multiple spots & that it is assumed that the figure can turn on the spot. The way vehicle rules currently read don't allow for this. They are specific in where sight can be taken from therefore over-riding the official rules. As such whilst it may be fairly intuitive it will allow a lot of room for interpretation & rules lawyering.

Quote:

Originally Posted by IAmBatman (Post 2319553)
Also, card looks awesome! :-) I'm a tad iffy on how nautical the wheel looks there. Anyway we can keep it distinctive but make it look a tad more modern?

I went with the helm wheel as it was a less likely to be used but still recognisable. My first thought was the car steering wheel but I didn't want it seeming like it was going to be changed with every type vehicle, like motorcycle handlebars for motorbikes & yoke sticks for planes. I can change to a car steering wheel but I was trying to avoid stereotyping the DVDOs as all cars.


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:34 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2022 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.