The Book of Lobster Johnson
The Book of Lobster Johnson C3G DARK HORSE WAVE 21 DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE http://heroscapers.com/c3g/released/...nson_comic.png Comic PDF http://heroscapers.com/c3g/released/...hnson_mini.png Mini PDF The figure used for this unit is a Heroclix figure from the Indy set. Its model number and name are #034-036, 212 / Lobster Johnson. _________________________________________________________________ Character Bio - Lobster Johnson started his career in 1932, working with a small but trusted group of allies out of a secret base in the sewers of New York City. Together they fought against gangsters, spies, and the like. In 1937 the gang came up against one of their most imposing enemies to date - the inscrutable and immeasurably powerful Memnan Saa, during the case of the Iron Prometheus. Though the Lobster and his allies escaped the confrontation with their lives, tragedy dogged them thereafter as they continued to research his crimes and history. One by one, the Lobster's allies met various gruesome and mysterious ends, until the Lobster called off the search. Not long after this, he accepted an offer of employment from the United States Government, a chance to lay some ghosts to rest. Lobster Johnson died during an unsuccessful attempt to prevent the Nazis from launching a space capsule at Hunte Castle, Austria on 20 March 1939. However Death was not the end for Lobster Johnson. His ghost was one of the strongest to be seen in the Hellboy universe. He was completely corporeal when he chose to be, firing his pistol with deadly effect and burning his sign into the forehead of his victims. It would appear that his death greatly increased his powers. In 2001, Hellboy (a lifelong Lobster fan) and Roger the homunculus encountered his ghost in the haunted ruins of Hunte Castle, beginning a long association between the Lobster and the BPRD, and with Roger and Johann Kraus in particular. The Lobster was instrumental in helping them defeat Rasputin, the Conqueror Worm and Hermann von Klempt, completing in death the mission he had failed to do in life. _________________________________________________________________ -Rulings and Clarifications-
-Combinations and Synergies- Incoming Synergy:
-Immunities, Benefits, and Weaknesses- Immunities
-Strategy, Tactics and Tips-
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
NAME = LOBSTER JOHNSON
SPECIES = HUMAN UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO CLASS = INVESTIGATOR PERSONALITY = DETERMINED SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5 LIFE = 4 MOVE = 5 RANGE = 5 ATTACK = 4 DEFENSE = 4 POINTS = 180 SPIRIT ARISE If Lobster Johnson is destroyed while his Species is Human, remove all Wound Markers from this card and place him on any empty space either in your Start Zone or within 3 spaces of an Investigator figure you control. For the remainder of the game, Lobster Johnson's Species is Entity instead of what is listed on the card, and you may add 2 to his Move number. GHOSTLY INTANGIBILITY While Lobster Johnson's Species is Entity, he can move through all figures, Fortress Walls, and obstacles, is never attacked when leaving an engagement, and cannot be targeted by opponents' non-adjacent figures for any attacks or for any opponents' special powers that require clear sight. HELPFUL GHOST While Lobster Johnson's Species is Entity, all Investigators you control add one additional die when defending against a normal or special attack from an opponent's figure that is within 3 spaces of Lobster Johnson. |
Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Ok, this took a while to get down what was in my head that I wanted to do with him & into mechanics. Sadly it's 4 powers which I didn't intend it to be but I thought it best that Helpful Ghost's powers were separate to Spirit Arise. But the powers do accomplish what I wanted from him. Which was a basic character before death then a more helpful ghost after death.
Not attached to the names so if you think of something better then suggest away. If we didn't want the close synergy to the other BRPD characters he could be a Crime Fighter. |
Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Woah, pretty cool. He's definitely tough to start out with. Maybe make his marksmanship dependant if he's a human? That way he plays totally different after his death. I don't know the character at all, though.
The only other thing is we use undead rather than ghost for species, but I could roll with it to avoid the synergies. |
Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
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BTW LP, I saw you post as I was sending the PM's so I didn't send it to you :D. |
Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
If we change that, then as human he's more offensive, and as a ghost he's more defensive, but if the theme is that he's supposed to be more powerful in general, then that works.
Gentleman Ghost is an undead, but I'm fine with ghost here. |
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Any reason why you need an Investigator to get him back from the dead?
He should be Undead, but I could swing Energy if we're really set on not including him in synergies. |
Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
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He ostensibly has 8 life here. And a really nasty ranged attack. What power level are we going for here? Honestly, I really like the ghostly power set, but I don't love four powers. Considering he has so much staying power, I wonder if it wouldn't be worthwhile to drop the marksman power and just focus on the ghost stuff? You could always bump his normal attack to 5. A ranged attack of 5 is pretty nasty all on its own. |
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Ah, sorry, completely missed the start zone bit!
Only other issue I have is the intangibility bit... does the second half always apply, or only for when he's ghostly? |
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Not liking the Expert Marksman power right now. Two auto-skulls seems way above his power level. I mean, as a human, the guy was just pulp hero, vigilante type. If we need a marksman power here, I'd rather use Marksmanship from Dum Dum Dugan. Really though, at this point I would rather just drop it. He's not really the type of unit that warrants four all new powers.
Otherwise, I like the powerset, and it's better than I anything I had for him, so :up: to you there. I do have to say that I'm a little disappointed not to see a "branding" power on him (he would burn a lobster claw mark on to the forehead of his victims), but it's not the kind of thing that makes for a very interesting power and there's not really room for it here. EDIT: Like johnny, I also missed the startzone bit. Would this wording make Spirit Arise any clearer? Quote:
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Another stab at it
SPIRIT ARISE If Lobster Johnson is destroyed while his species is Human, remove all Wound Markers from this card and place him on any empty space either in your Start Zone or within 3 spaces of an Investigator figure you control. For the remainder of the game Lobster Johnson's species is Ghost instead of what is listed on the card and you may add 1 to his Move number. GHOSTLY INTANGIBILITY While Lobster Johnson's species is Ghost, he can move through all figures and obstacles such as ruins, is never attacked when leaving an engagement, and cannot be targeted by opponents' non-adjacent figures for any attacks or for any opponents' special powers that require clear sight. HELPFUL GHOST While Lobster Johnson's species is Ghost, all Investigators you control add one additional die when defending against a normal or special attack from an opponent's figure that is within 3 spaces of Lobster Johnston. |
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
That looks good. The one thing that still feels a bit "off" to me is the increase in his move number by one being in Spirit Arise. It just seems too "thrown in" to that power, IMO.
The Ghostly Intangibility power is the "stat boost in ghost form" power, so it should be there if anywhere (and I'm not sure it needs to be there at all). Also, we're going with "Entity" over "Ghost," right? |
Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Yeah, I'd prefer "Spirit" or "Entity" over "Ghost".
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
I considered "Spirit," but we've already used it as a Class.
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Yep Entity, when the 48 hours is up. ;) |
Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
FWIW, I agree with TB about Marksman.
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
If you want to give him enough move to mimic teleportation, I'd go with more of a boost than +1. Why not, say, +4?
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Well, now that I know the theme of it .... :-) +1 Move doesn't seem to be worth the text or communicate the theme well. +4 Move might.
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
I think intangibility covers that close enough. I gave Gentleman Ghost 7 Move + Intangibility to represent popping in and out of existence... maybe give him a base 6 and have that stable?
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Alright, I will make the move +2 to match Gentleman Ghost. SP updated.
Can anybody confirm that his secret identity is correct. I can't seem to find it anywhere I have tried. |
Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
I'd just go with Lobster Johnson, no Secret Identity... I can't find any concrete references.
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Is this guy ready for an initial? I can add him to my "to do" list after I finish my other one (which I'll hopefully get to this week at some point).
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
ERB from Dok:
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
ERB from Davidlhsl:
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Yep, no worries about that from me. Plenty of figures have counters that nerf them.
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Any thoughts on starting cost for this guy? :-) I'm hoping to start on his initial this/next week.
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
I'm thinking anywhere from 170-200. I've got the sheet written up for a playtest, but haven't started yet (busy weekend!).
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
C3G INITIAL PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM
NAME OF THE TEST UNIT (LOBSTER JOHNSON) - THEME TEST/ Check to see if there are any powers or stats on the test unit card that does not accurately reflect the theme or likeness of what the character would and could do. Also consider destructible objects, and whether or not this characters powers should affect them. PASS - MIRROR TEST/ Check to see if the unit were played against itself, if there would be any loops that would upset the balance of the Game. PASS - BONDING TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing Bonding abilities to make sure there are no continual Bonding possibilities that do not stop appropriately or do not stop at all. This is to prevent loops in Bonding. PASS - SYNERGIES TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing synergies to make sure there are no factors that could break the game by making any unit to powerful or too weak. PASS - POWER CHECK/ Consider the test unit and all existing units and all glyphs to compare to and check for any powers that could be over amplified and break the game. Each power must define when it takes place, who or what it affects, and What are the stipulations on the power if there are any. PASS - FUN TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play. PASS An odd case where you're almost rooting for him to die the first time! - FUN COMPETITIVE TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play against. PASS - DRAFTING TEST/ Consider whether or not this design is worth drafting. PASS - USAGE TEST/ Consider whether or not all of the powers on this card were used or at least usable. PASS I even like the +2 Move as an Entity, because it helps him get through other figures and get position. - STRATEGY TEST/ Consider whether or not the design offers any real strategy or interesting tactics to the overall game. PASS Heavy Hitter or Mid-Level Hero Test - Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes - What should be the unit's point value? 180-190. - Give a brief overview. He's probably 170-180 at most on his own, but Helpful Ghost seems worth bumping him a tad for Army Tests.
Spoiler Alert!
_____________________________________________________________ Squad Test - Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes - What should be the unit's point value? 180 felt good. - Give a brief overview. 8 Life and strategic positioning helps Lobster stay competitive here. Map: Custom Units: Lobster Johnson vs. Arkham Inmates x3 (180)
Spoiler Alert!
_____________________________________________________________ Squad Test - Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes. - What should be the unit's point value? 120? - Give a brief overview. Vampire Minions didn't need any help from Bloodthirsty – three attacks of 4 a turn tore Lobster Johnson up. Map: Custom Units: Lobster Johnson vs. Vampire Minions x2 (180)
Spoiler Alert!
_____________________________________________________________ Army Test - Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes - What should be the unit's point value? 170-180. - Give a brief overview. Lobster got the lion's share of the work here, but could only muster one wound on Darkseid, thanks to poor rolls and shadow tiles. His defensive boost wasn't nearly as helpful as I thought, thanks in part to Darkseid hiding behind trees to attack other figures. Map: Custom Units: Lobster Johnson (190), Wolfsbane (130), Siryn (140), Oracle (110) (570) vs. Darkseid (380), Joker (190) (570)
Spoiler Alert!
_____________________________________________________________ Army Test - Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes - What should be the unit's point value? 170. - Give a brief overview. Lobster Johnson's defensive boost really helped Multiple Man (Lobster turned Ghost in Round 1) but Cap backed Spawn was just too much of a crowd crusher. Map: Custom Units: Lobster Johnson (180), Abe Sapien (150), Multiple Man x22 (660) (990) vs. Uncle Sam (240), Spawn (320), Captain America (240), Bucky (60), Falcon (140) (1,000)
Spoiler Alert!
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
I think he's good at 170-180. Having a tougher Investigator in Hellboy to pair with might help, but he was an especially good friend to Multiple Man.
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
I propose Lobster Johnson move to public playtesting @180.
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Yea
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Yea
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Design
Yea.
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - VOTE for Public Playtestin
I don't feel comfortable calling on just three votes.
SirG, Lord Pyre, Quozl ? |
Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - VOTE for Public Playtestin
Sorry, don't know how I missed this.
Yea |
Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - VOTE for Public Playtestin
yea
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - VOTE for Public Playtestin
Yea
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - VOTE for Public Playtestin
This passes. Thanx guys.
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - VOTE for Public Playtestin
Playtest from Heroscaper Guy:
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Playtesting
180's looking good to me so far. :-)
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Re: The Book of Lobster Johnson - Playtesting
Playtest from Zettian Juggernaut:
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