AtG's Customs [NEW 4/22/22]
 

Welcome to my Customs showcase! I'm seeking initial feedback on anything like the left box, right box, verbiage, mechanics, value, utility, name, and model choice.
Thanks for swinging by :D

CURRENT CONCEPTS
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...714&height=676
These are the other three figures from the pending Ogre Warband set that Gozar comes in.
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...645&height=609
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...638&height=609
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...641&height=609


Some mechanical/simplification updates to Ilvara.
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...609&height=609
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...691&height=676
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...604&height=572
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...611&height=577
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...607&height=572
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...606&height=572
"Martial (Spectacles, XVII, XXVI) celebrates Carpophorus, who was renowned as a bestiarius, having dispatched a bear, lion, and leopard. Had he been alive at the time, "Marathon would not have feared her bull, nor leafy Nemea her lion, nor Arcadians the boar of Maenalus" (XXXII). Indeed, says Martial, the redoubtable Carpophorus killed twenty wild animals at one time."
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...592&height=577

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

After several iterations, I've finally landed on this card for the Wasteland Marauders. For those of you that haven't seen this card in the Pre-SoV Workshop, it is a squad inspired by the "War Boys" from the Mad Max world.
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...645&height=609

WASTELAND MARAUDERS
VALKRILL

Species: MUTANTS (same as Motley Max)
Type: COMMON SQUAD (squad of 2)
Class: MARAUDERS
Personality: WILD

Stats:
L1
M5
R1
A3
D3

Abilities:
WITNESS ME!
After revealing an Order Marker on the Wasteland Marauders' Army Card and taking a turn with the Wasteland Marauders, if at least one Wasteland Marauder is engaged, you may immediately take a turn with one Warhulk Hero you control.

MUTATED SKIN 14
When a Wasteland Marauder would receive one or more wounds from a terrain effect or special attack, before inflicting those wounds, roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 14 or higher, ignore any wounds.

INCITE VIOLENCE
Anytime you roll the 20-sided die for a Warhulk Army Card, you may add 1 to your roll for every Wasteland Marauder that is adjacent to that Warhulk.

Outgoing Synergy(that I'm aware of)
Pseudo Bonding: Motley Max, Ogre Warhulk

Incoming Synergy(that I'm aware of)
Valkrill Attack Aura: Skull Demons

The models intended for use are from Pathfinder Battles, City of Lost Omens set. Xulgath Skulker #12 & Xulgath Warrior #13. Both with great availability online, priced at roughly $2 per figure.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

@Dad_Scaper @Scytale if you don't mind?

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

I don't like the name Witness Me!. Some may get the reference, but I don't.

Incite Violence is strangely terrible with the Ogre Warhulk. It makes him even more likely to kill them. While that's thematic, I think in practice it's a bad power (unless you want to discourage synergy with the Ogre Warhulk).

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

I love how you reused War Cry as Witness Me! The Mutant Skin power (basically Stealth Suit) gives them a chance to live long enough to do something useful. The bonding is easier because all you need is to have an engaged Marauder; the Warhulk you take a turn with does not need to be in clear sight or x number of spaces. I might bring the price down five or ten points, but I guess playtesting will reveal whether that's a good change to make.

Solid unit!

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

..."to a Warhulk" instead of "to that Warhulk" ?

Not a fan of Mutant as a species...for me mutants tend to be a species that have mutations - but that might just be me. I'd use Xulgath or come up with your own name for the species...or possibly call them Lizardfolk Mutants who are Wild Marauders.

But in general, I like the design.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

I'm digging this design. I'm cool with these being mutants circa earth 2210. As I feel it establishes a cool precadent.

Witness me is a fine name fora personal custom, not so fitting for canon.incite violence is superfluous at best. Remember not every custom needs 3 powers.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

The Ogre Warhulk power "Mine!" also has an exclamation point, if that's what's bothering you.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

What a great idea Andre :D

I'm a fan of incite violence, but I'm also a Rakdos player at heart so that may be why lol. A 2 man squad seems like a great fit for a warhulk that just wants a couple of cronies around to make trouble and egg him on.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Which also raises the question, how does "Incite Violence" work with "Mine!"?

I kinda like that Incite Violence increases the Warhulk's odds of killing his own. They're egging him on and then they get clobbered: a very Mad-Max visual gag really. Even if they get killed (which they might not with the Mutated Skin) it's probably worth it; the Ogre Warhulk doesn't feel worth his 150 points when he's not swinging at his full power. That whirlwind attack for 5 on a double-spaced figure is what you're paying for.

Don't know how they'll compete with the Deathchasers on that front though. They don't really need the Warhulk that bad but he may certainly still prefer them.

~TAF

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Thanks for the tag, and thanks for sharing this custom!

I suppose from the name of the thread that you believe these will one day be suitable for the SoV. I will comment on them with that in mind. Note that you don't *have* to do that. You can make your own excellent customs, and they can be excellent customs. Or you can make your own excellent customs, and ask a bunch of picky strangers to tell you if they belong in the official canon. They might tell you no. They might not! Their answer does not bear on the excellence of the customs themselves. As we will see, soon enough, in my comments below.

You have here a "mutant" that you indicate fits in on the near-future Earth where we find Motley Max. I firmly disagree.

Earthlings are *all* humans, with a single exception. That single exception - Motley Max - is very nearly human-looking, as well. The creatures on this card do not look nearly-human. They look monstrous. Their heads are almost avian in shape, and I do not look at them and think, "these things may have had human parents." And without that quality - the human parents piece - I cannot conceive of them as mutants.

Still drilling down on the mutant issue, it does not make sense to me that an army of "mutants" would be so similar to each other. Isn't the defining feature of a mutant that it's an aberration? Why would so many "aberrations" coincidentally be the same as each other? That's certainly not the X-Men vision of how mutants are, and it's not mine either. I do not think that a mass of (relatively) identical figures work as "mutants." That's just unacceptable, to me.

I recognize that others have said that it looks ok to them. I wonder if they've all thought this through, and I'd be concerned - in your shoes - that this particular criticism might get traction later, even if it's not an issue now.

I would also back off "mutated skin." It's not suggested by the mini and it's not present on the only other mutant, so it comes across (to me, anyway) as an easy way to make your two-man melee squad more durable. Which is a laudable goal! The challenge is to do it elegantly, rather than in a way that looks forced.

I don't care for the power name "Witness Me!" because I don't think it's communicating a clear theme. How is that working? What story is being told here?

I like the idea of something that motivates Warhulks. I also like the idea of a common squad that might be able to justify fielding two Ogre Warhulks. That would be cool!

But I'd take the theme here back to the drawing board, and see what other ideas these cool minis give you.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

I agree that these would not make sense from near-future Earth, however nowhere does this thread indicate that. It says "inspired by the "War Boys" from the Mad Max world", to give a sense of the real-world inspiration behind the theme and powers. Andre may have suggested it elsewhere, but as you say I would advise against that.

Given the above, not looking human is a moot point. Other beings can mutate and thus also be mutants. There is no reason the species Mutant must be exclusive to mutated humans.

I understand where you're coming from, and yet most X-Men look like normal homo sapiens. There are a couple other slightly different sculpts with different skin tones and patterns, would that help in your eyes? That would be acceptable to me.

See above comment about different skin tones. If it was a three-figure squad and each one was a different color, would the theme come through better and feel less forced? Again, I'd be on board with it.

I get the reference though I've never seen Mad Max (shame, I know), so I may be wrong but I think it fits with the whole "glorified violence" mentality of the post-apocalypse (as well as the Incite Violence power). Saying, "I found another skull to bash in! Come watch!"

That would be cool. I haven't played the Ogre Warhulk much, though I never cared for him too much either, at least in part on account of the price tag. It still might be a tall task given that two of them are a whopping 300 points, but as with other mediocre and underused units, I always love to see more on the battlefield.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

My point with the X-Men is that they have different powers. Each is its own mutation. A field of nearly-identical mutated creatures - mutated humans or otherwise - doesn't work.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Mutated Skin does not protect against the Ogre Warhulk since he uses normal attacks. They are likely to die against his attacks, making them sacrifices for a measly +1. The real problem is that you want multiple of them to beef up the chance, which means you will likely loose even more, but there must necessarily be fewer enemy unit adjacent to be able to do so. I think this power is a straight-up liability with Ogre Warhulks and in the long run people will not pair the two.

For the record, I agree with D_S about Mutated Skin. I get Andre's explanation, but I don't think the minis or the trope suggest it. But I'm not strongly against it either, as the explanation does make sense.

I disagree with D_S about making them earthers. I'm fine with future earth mutants straying from humanity, whether by strange mutations or human experimentation. At least from the picture these look like they have some human in them. Don't expect this opinion to be dominant in VC, though.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

I wonder if it would be easier to work with these minis by making one of them a common hero. Making them a squad is introducing the challenges of creating a 2 man melee squad without an obvious payoff. And if we were looking at a hero, even a cheap common one, the effect of multiple identical “mutants” wouldn’t be quite so jarring. Whether from earth or otherwise.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

You're referring to a Nottingham Brigand-type route?
Alternatively, there's been both preference and distaste for different colored models for this squad. If I stick with the Xulgaths (which I really want to), there are 4 I have to choose from- https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...78140/xuls.PNG

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Right. I’m phone posting right now so I’m keeping these kind of short, but the idea is that designing a 3 man melee squad is very difficult. You need it to be something that can be part of an army that can cross a battlefield, but moving 2 at a time you can’t easily get there. So you have to add a gadget to the card to increase survivability. Making them common heroes simplifies the choices and the role on the battlefield in a way that can be helpful to a designer.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

The only issue with 4 man is the minis don't all look like mutants like the first two.

You may want to reevaluate what your goal is. If you only want a SoV induction you are going to have a hard time since your vision will be corrupt Ed by the odd judges that comment.

You really want a concrete vision which seems to be mauraders that synergize with Max. Figure out which minis you want to use are first. Then build you power house to make them fun and interesting. things like personality, and class should flow from there as natural extension of the design. If you are lucky what you end up with will fit into cannon. If not you will still have an awesome custom.

I literally have a hundred custom units in my personal collection, and some are my favorite units overall. They will never be SoV units and that is okay as long as I, my friends and family enjoy them.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

I created this thread to gather feedback on custom units that I confidently feel have a fighting chance in the SoV process. Sure, I have dozens of custom cards in a folder, but these are the ones I am serious about submitting to SoV at some point. Normally I would just post in the SoV Workshop, but the intent here is to get help polishing a card so that it's as ready as possible for playtesting and subsequently the judges. If concepts don't make it out of this thread, then so be it. That doesn't mean I'm gonna stop trying :thumbsup:

A big thanks to everyone who has dropped in to help so far!

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

So knowing that there is only one 3-man squad with bonding to make it through SoV (Zettian Infantry), and multiple 1-man cards with bonding, are my chances statistically better of passing with a common hero with bonding vs. common squad with bonding?

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Statistics mean nothing. A great unit will pass, anything else will fail.

The problem with the figures is that, from the pictures at least, the first two figures are so similar in look that the other two don't fit. Maybe the third (I'd have to see a picture of them side-by-side on the battlefield), but the 4th is really out there. If I were making a custom with these, I would probably use all four with a repaint job to give them all the same coloration.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

I agree completely with Scy.

The statistics don’t mean anything. Please don’t try to reverse engineer us. The low number of small melee squads is probably just a reflection of the fact that small common melee squads are extremely difficult to do well. Even 3-man melee squads, and this one is only 2.

And adding other minis that don’t match the first 2 is a step backward, not forward.

Consider, as I suggested, a common hero. Several of your problems might just go away. See what you get.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

You could also consider only using 1 of the matching color sculpts with the 2 that don’t match. Then the not matching wouldn’t stick out like it does with 2 of the 4 matching.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Wasn't my intent- just trying to get a feel for what makes the most sense. These are uncharted waters for me and I'm still learning.

It's easy to get diverted with so many different opinions. I was influenced by an idea that different colored mutants might be plausible, but I should have gone with my gut.

The figures should come in soon and I will upload better pics for comparison. If the pigment is pretty far off, I would consider transitioning to a common hero.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Of course! And I appreciate you sharing your customs with us.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

To the best of my knowledge Andre has the stated goal of expanding on the lore of the war-torn far-future earth using the media precedent of “Mad Max” and the C3V precedent of Motley Max. (Whom I assume is also inspired by Mad Max. I, like Necroblade, have never seen Mad Max, so I don’t have that experience to draw from.) Given only the look of the miniatures, the above stated goal, and the precedent of Motley Max’s card and character bio. I can see these miniatures as They Who Laugh, those creatures left out in the wilderness that are referenced in Max’s bio or as a non-specific band of mutant desert scavengers. Either way, the minis fit the theme for me.

I’m not too fussed over the miniature debate. Two flesh toned figures vs three with separate colorings doesn’t make much of a difference to me. I would lean fleshy, but Mutants as a species don’t have much precedent. I’m not anybody who needs convincing on either point. I think both could work but photos of miniatures might change my mind. If you do go the common hero route, I definitely think the best sculpt is the flesh colored one with two knives.

Slight tangent, but Motley Max and Agent Carr seem to be from two different future earths. Max is from a collapsed California while Carr is from an intact New York City. Can the VC creators shed a little light on the timeline here? Or are they from separate versions of Earth’s multiverse?

Now onto the card.

A 2-figure wild mutant marauder common squad that follows Valkrill makes sense to me. Nihilist instead of Wild could be cool. It’s a tie back to the description given in Motley Max’s bio, and it’s an existing personality that, to the best of my knowledge, is only shared with Thanos.

Regarding WITNESS ME!, I agree with Scytale. I don’t get the reference. Of course, since I don’t get the reference, I have to go look it up. *One trip to the Mad Max wiki and one trip to YouTube later.* I now don’t like the name for another reason.

Personally, a power called WITNESS ME! would not be the pseudo-bonding power. It would be a cross between OVEREXTEND ATTACK and the Deathstrike Thrall’s RETURN TO THE GRAVE Special Attack. That or something like the effect of Kuthnak’s INCANTATION OF BOILING BLOOD. The lore behind the witness is that the War Boy goes out in a blaze of glory worthy of Valhalla. Perhaps call it GLORY IN DEATH, or something, since we don’t want to use WITNESS ME! Because Scy and others don’t get the reference.

To be clear, I am not saying this kind of power is necessary for the design, I am saying that this is in theme and a better way of portraying the theme of “Witness Me!”

The to-be-renamed-Warhulk-Hero-pseudo-bonding-power itself is also weird to me. As it runs into the same problem that Deathcommander Mark 3 and the Mohican River Tribe have, in that they don’t get the pseudo-bonding turns if they kill the thing they’re engaged to. Maybe try “if at least one Wasteland Marauder destroyed a figure this turn” instead. It seems to me, more thematic for the Warhulk to want to join a fight already going well than to go “fine let me do it myself.” Although, as I type that out, I am less convinced of that reasoning. I actually think its fine either way. Perhaps change the condition to “if at least one Wasteland Marauder attacked an opponent’s figure this turn.” That covers both bases. I would also be fine if this doesn’t change at all.

Also, Mok is a Warhulk Hero too. So he needs to be considered with any power that grants a Warhulk Hero a free turn. (Maybe restrict to Large Warhulk, if it’s an issue. I don’t think it is.)

Regarding MUTANT SKIN 14, I really like the resistance to terrain effects, it conveys that these guys are used to these desolate climates and therefore can sometimes withstand lava field damage. I think it is worded properly to not give them a 35% chance to ignore Lava. I think Lava automatically destroys and doesn’t inflict wounds so MUTANT SKIN doesn’t apply, which is good.

Regarding INCITE VIOLENCE, I again, agree with Scytale. It severely discourages synergy with the Ogre Warhulk (and with Mok since you don’t want to lose your dwarven gunners in a build with the Wasteland Marauders since you’d probably only run 1 squad of Axegrinders.) I also tend to agree with wriggz in that the power might just be superfluous. With a 2-figure squad the priority needs to be on attacking and getting Warhulk turns, not boosting your Warhulk’s D20 rolls. I doubt you’ll have enough figures to do both consistently.

I like Dad_Scaper’s suggestion of the Common Hero as a solution to a few of the problems he has. As such, I’m going to take a draft pass at the common hero version. It goes in a different direction but, I feel, within the same theme. Of course, this isn’t meant to upstage the design, just to air more ideas. (I asked Andre first, before I posted this in his thread.) Also, anywhere on my card it says “Warhulk Hero” I think “Merciless Hero” could also fit the theme and give a different set of interesting bonding options (Bugbear Basher, Deathstrike Thrall, Emperor Andask, Motley Max, Tetraites, and Viceron the Blood Knight)



I’ll leave it there, thoughts?

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Earth has multiple biomes and cultures now. Why wouldn't it in the future?

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

There is a tenuous theory that the microcorp agents refer to the 2210 version of risk. If you accept that premis then the world will be scorched by nuclear weapons, over run with corporations and the moon will be colonized. That world would have haves and have nots leading to mega cities where Carr, krav and the twilight clan live and waste lands with Max and...

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Works for me. Thanks guys!

(I'm also watching Fury Road tonight.)

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Andre messaged me on Discord asking if I'd be willing to share my thoughts, so here I am!

Regarding the question of whether the design should be a common hero or squad, I agree with DS and others who think that the current design would mechanically struggle to work as a two-man squad. Mechanically its pretty difficult to design two man squads that are effective, and in this case I'd want to see how often a player would end up choosing to forego an attack with the Marauders in order to trigger their bonding. If that situation occurred with any sort of regularity, it would strike me as pretty unthematic.

I think the common hero approach could work, but that would likely require a pretty radical redesign of the power set.

On the other hand, I'd personally not be bothered at all by a 3 man squad, as long as you picked three sculpts that all looked somewhat distinct from each other, to avoid one of them being the odd man out.

Like Scytale, I also don't have a problem with these being severely mutated former humans from Earth 2210+. Wild as a personality works fine, but I agree with Vydar that Nihilist could also work great here and be a nice callback to Motley's bio.

I've already touched on Witness Me! a bit, but I'll also add to what people are saying that the name isn't doing it for me. I'd be fine with just straight Warlord Bonding here, but either way I think a better name could be found. However, I am a bit concerned that bonding with Mok might be too powerful/swingy and would want to see testing results to confirm that synergy was not unfun to play against. If that was an issue, the bonding could always be limited to small, medium, or large warhulk heroes.

I also dislike the name for Mutated Skin 14. I get the idea you're going for, but I don't think it quite works.

As a potential alternative, I quite like the name Survival of the Strangest, but other people may not appreciate the wordplay there as much as me. Another potentially safer option might be Survival Instincts.

Finally, I actually quite like Incite to Violence. Since the +1 is optional, I don't think it discourages pairing with the Ogre Warhulk as much as other people think. The one change I would make is to limit it to working with heroes, as I'm not quite sure how the adjacency requirement would work if there was ever a warhulk squad.

Throwing this all together:

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

We haven't see strait bonding in a while and sometimes the oldies are the goodies.

Everything else Cap said are really great suggestions, but you are moving towards design by committee rather than design by passion.

That said Mutant might be a sticky wicket so you could always compromise and call them lurkers or dwellers from a generic planet like feylund/grut/Valhalla. They will end up bonding with an ogre so it is not like earth mutants are the only option. They basically seem like kobold but in place of dragons they look for the strongest brute to follow.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Just chiming in to say that behind the scenes in VC there was a general idea that 2210 took inspiration from Judge Dredd or Dark Future, where there are dystopian megacities dotting an otherwise blasted wasteland hellscape. This allows Carr’s New York to exist while most of California has collapsed. Presumably Los Angeles is a megacity as well, but that’ll be for future units.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Sounds like Risk 2210 🙂

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Ah! Never played it so I’m glad it jives with the soft lore we’ve pulled from that.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

I'm loving all the input received so far, and I have a strong vision about this being a squad of at least 2 units (hopefully 3, depending on how the Chief looks). I'm likely going to be simplifying this card by dropping INCITE VIOLENCE and reverting to standard Warhulk Bonding. My question is, do you imagine there ever being a Small or Medium Warhulk in the future? When I think of Warhulk, I picture a Large unit at minimum. Considering Mok is a Warhulk, I'll have to add a size restriction on it. Should I just go "Small, Medium, or Large Warhulk you control"?

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Could always go with Large exclusively like the Death Chasers do.

~TAF

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

I'm not sure you need a restriction on size, I don't see Mok bonding with a non-dwarf squad to be problematic.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

If his aim is SoV the in world reason for the bonding will be heavily scrutinized, so I'd advise for the smallest bonding web possible.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Minis came in. The white one is basically out of the question at this point. How are we feeling about the green one @Scytale @Dad_Scaper @MegaSilver , questionable? Passable?
.

https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...901&height=676
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...901&height=676

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Seeing photos of the actual figures next to each other really brings out the difference. I can't decide whether the green or the white look less fitting. If you try for a 3 person squad, you could have one of each color, but if you go with the two tan ones for a 2 person squad, I think they blend in with Motley much nicer than the rest.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Yeah I picked up the minis as well. In person the white one looks like a white version of the tan, whereas the green one is far more distinct. I would either go 2 man tan or 3 man one of each color.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Would vote for 1 of each as well if you decide to go for 3 man ^^

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

One of each looks best to me. If you have both tan ones, then the squad would look worse with whichever third one you go with.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Pre-Pre-SoV Thread
 

Cut one of the tan ones, and have a three man that are all different colors. If you use the two tan ones, then it looks weird that only one of them doesn't fit, but if you lean into the color mismatch as part of the theme, it should work well since they are mutants, which would logically all be slightly differently mutated.

If you wanted to use the 2 tan figures, I'd say you should make them a 2 man squad, and make the other 2 heros. So that's an option as well.

Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs (New cards! 8/26/21)
 

I looked back at Motley Max's bio and remembered- his gang is not marauders or traders. They are fueled by destruction. Vandals as a class seems much more fitting. As does Nihilistic for the personality- inspired by Motley's bio. The green and white figures are ultimately off-putting to me, and so I'm going to continue this attempt as a 2-man squad (wish me luck). I've also renamed the secondary ability to ENVIRONMENTAL RESISTANCE 14 to more closely reflect Ziggo's ENVIRONMENTAL SUIT.

Let me know your thoughts!
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...716&height=676

Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs (New cards! 8/26/21)
 

My experience playing Motley has left something to be desired. Perhaps I've been unlucky or not played him well, but a synergy for the lad would be nice. Currently, I don't see a ton of reason yet to bring these guys to the table other than for their bonding. Besides Environmental Resistance, a situational defense which isn't bad, their stats are quite general. One thing for certain, I do not think they are worth 50 points in this state, but that could need playtesting to declare.

Take Beakface Sneaks for instance (a recent favorite of mine) being 30 points. On the outside they appear general, but in many situations, they are taskmasters. With evasive 3 they are almost guaranteed a run in swipe unless engaged first. 6 movement, with a movement bonding of sorts for bringing in backup or holding glyphs and high ground.
Again, 30 points! Though bonding is valuable and 3 def is unarguable, I would experiment with lowering these guys to 40 and playtest, and I'd be happy to help playtest once you feel settled on something. Only bring up to 50+ if they have another ability involved. (The 2-figure squad I find most overpriced is the Banshees, though "situationally" against high defense squads, played right, they have a chance to make up for it.)

I quite liked Incite Violence as well. I can't recall exactly what was disagreed on about it in your pre pre SoV critique, wherever that was, besides the Ogre Warhulks Flail. (Edit: *facepalm* I now see it is this very thread renamed*). It felt fitting, and could be worked with. Maybe it doesn't have to only be for Warhulks. Or maybe you could have the option to sacrifice an adjacent Vandal to add +3 to your resulted Engagement Strike roll, (thematically where the vandal gets involved, causing the engagement wound, but taking a wound in return).

Anyway, I'm sure I'm looking into this early rehash of these guys a bit too much, but its nice to keep that ball rolling. I’d say hold onto your vision on them mainly as a MM posse, and any other (not broken) synergies that come along should be welcomed.

An option for using the other 2 figures could be uncommon heroes like the Skull Demons are with separate models. Or unique heroes. Or maybe they are in necessary.

Final note. I feel "Vandals" could work, but Nihilistic doesn't feel right to me. I see it only as a view or belief than personality. How does the Nihilism affect their personality? Does it make them "wild", "careless", "fearlees", "reckless", etc?

Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs (New cards! 8/26/21)
 

I could picture that. Comparing them to the other Valkrill 2-mans...
Death Knights: 2 attack (with a -2 defense debuff), 60 pts.
Mezzos: 3 attack (with range, and +1 life per mezzo), 65 pts.
Tomb Archers: 1 attack (2 if target's unengaged, with range), 30 pts.

I would consider them at 40 pts. If I bring their attack up to 4, they'll likely stay around 50. We have to factor in the bonding into their point value as well. I'll take you up on playtesting when the time comes :)

I've also considered this, but by giving them a survivability power, it would be going in the opposite direction to make them sacrificial. I removed the power altogether when someone put something into perspective for me. Motley already lands his hook 75% of the time, he doesn't need any help with those odds. On top of that, the mechanic would need to be reverse (conditional) bonding like I had before. It ended up being too convoluted and difficult to engineer. I'll leave the reverse bonding to C3V :p. What I've learned about SoV so far- a card doesn't need 3+ abilities to have flavor. It can be just as flavorful with 2 8)

If I do go the route of a d20 boost for Warhulks, it would probably be on the card of a Unique Warhulk with WARHULK SUPREMACY +1 anytime you roll the d20 for a Warhulk.

Maybe even Merciless like their merciless leader Motley..

Re: AndreThaGiant's Customs (New cards! 8/26/21)
 

I like where this is headed. However, I’m a big fan of 2 person squads and Motley Max, so I may be a bit biased. :D

My first thoughts on this is that the points are too high for those base stats and powers where they are currently. I know that was mentioned, so I won’t go into great detail there. That being said, I think 45 to 55 is a terrific spot for this type of squad. Going for less points is going to leave them squishy and/or uninteresting. Also, ending in that “5” helps with Max’s odd point cost. Because honestly with the role they’re designed for, 3 squads is about perfect.

Max 135
3x Vandals 135-165 depending…
270-300 total which leaves plenty of room for something else.

Maybe consider upping their move and defense by 1. Those sculpts look quick and agile, so I think the extra move and defense could be justified.

The bonding is nice! It’s simple and the size restriction is great too! Bonding with Mok could easily break them.

However, if you’re not sold on the size restriction, you could limit it to Valkrill Warhulks. It opens up future possibilities with different sized figures while still keeping Max as the primary option. (Which is what I believe you’re going for.) The other thought I had was to reverse the bonding. Let the warhulk take a turn after them. It’s like Max is sending out the expendable rabble to deal with people beneath him or to hold his victims in place while he mercilessly attacks them.

The name on the other power is a bit off to me. I get where you’re coming from, but with that name I don’t think Special Attacks should be included. However, I like very much that it works on Special Attacks! It gives you a reason to draft them even without a Warhulk. So I think you should definitely keep that concept in the design. I made a 2 person squad very similar to this one for Einar. Apocalyptic survivors who wear protective garb to protect them from terrain and special powers that deal wounds. It’s almost identical to this (which could explain why I am a fan of this custom). I called mine “Protective Garb”. That obviously won’t work on mutants in loincloths, but you could go with something like “Scaly Skin”, “Tough Skin”, “Thick Skin”, etc. You could also just split it into 2 powers. Environmental Resistance for the terrain effects, and something like Iron Resolve for the Special Attack. 3 powers on a common card is not unheard of (Cathar’s for example).

Finally, I absolutely love the name! (Weirdly enough, I named my 2 person unit Survivors of the Barren Wastes. I guess we both envision Max’s world the same. :)) It describes the unit perfectly!

I think nihilistic works for a personality too. Thanos introduced it, and that should be enough to make it work. After all, I think “arrogant” exists in Classic scape because of Ironman.

Keep up the good work! I’m looking forward to where this one ends up.