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-   -   Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread (https://www.heroscapers.com/community/showthread.php?t=31300)

dfonse January 26th, 2011 06:10 PM

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 
I have a good idea.

Killer Rabbit

Life 5
Move 6
Range1
Attack 1
Defense 2

Territorial: The killer rabbit does not start the game on the battlefield. At the start of each round, before you place order markers, roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 13 or higher you may place the killer rabbit anywhere on the battlefield on any empty space. You cannot place the killer rabbit within five clear sight spaces of enemy figures. THe killer rabbit may not move more than five spaces away from that place. While the killer rabbit is within 2 spaces of the space the rabbit gains 5 attack. If an enemy figure is on that spot the rabbit gains 9 attack instead of 5.

Behind the rabbit: An enemy figure may not be attacked by a unit that has been attacked by the rabbit, been inflicted wound by the rabbit or been in a squad that has had another figure been destroyed by the rabbit.



Stay away: When an opponent figure(s) enters a space that is both 3 spaces from the rabbits territorial position and 5 spaces from the rabbit roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 13 place one wound on the enemy figure and place the killer rabbit adjacent to that figure. If the killer rabbit destroys that figure place the killer rabbit on the space the destroyed figure was standing on.

This works because the killer rabbit was not aggressive in the movie (attack of 1). All the rabbit did was defend its position.

Lamaclown January 31st, 2011 12:37 PM

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 
So, where are we at on this?

I actually like "What, Behind the Rabbit?" with mac's wording change to address area special attacks.

The whole "targeted for an attack by a non-adjacent figure" does seem redundant since "unengaged" means all opponent's figures are non-adjacent.

How about...

Quote:

WHAT, BEHIND THE RABBIT?
If the Rabbit is unengaged, it may not be targeted for an attack unless the attacking figure began it's turn adjacent to the Rabbit.
It seems very clean and simple to understand to me. I am not against the idea of a special glyph to go with the rabbit but if we can keep it more simple than that I think that would be best.

Taeblewalker January 31st, 2011 12:46 PM

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lamaclown (Post 1328225)
So, where are we at on this?

I actually like "What, Behind the Rabbit?" with mac's wording change to address area special attacks.

The whole "targeted for an attack by a non-adjacent figure" does seem redundant since "unengaged" means all opponent's figures are non-adjacent.

How about...

Quote:

WHAT, BEHIND THE RABBIT?
If the Rabbit is unengaged, it may not be targeted for an attack unless the attacking figure began it's turn adjacent to the Rabbit.
It seems very clean and simple to understand to me. I am not against the idea of a special glyph to go with the rabbit but if we can keep it more simple than that I think that would be best.

So if you want to leave engagement with it, you can attack it from afar.

Lamaclown January 31st, 2011 12:51 PM

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Taeblewalker (Post 1328234)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lamaclown (Post 1328225)
So, where are we at on this?

I actually like "What, Behind the Rabbit?" with mac's wording change to address area special attacks.

The whole "targeted for an attack by a non-adjacent figure" does seem redundant since "unengaged" means all opponent's figures are non-adjacent.

How about...

Quote:

WHAT, BEHIND THE RABBIT?
If the Rabbit is unengaged, it may not be targeted for an attack unless the attacking figure began it's turn adjacent to the Rabbit.
It seems very clean and simple to understand to me. I am not against the idea of a special glyph to go with the rabbit but if we can keep it more simple than that I think that would be best.

So if you want to leave engagement with it, you can attack it from afar.

Yeah, I believe that was KC's original intent.

That was his reasoning behind the Territorial ability/weakness of the rabbit not being able to take leaving engagement strikes against figures. It gives the opponent the option of running away and then firing on the rabbit.

killercactus January 31st, 2011 12:58 PM

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 
One more time, trying to take everyone's comments and ideas into consideration:

Rabbit of Caerbannog
Monty Python's Quest for the Holy Grail
Valkrill
Unique Hero
Rabbit
Guard
Ferocious
Small 1
Move: 6
Range: 1
Attack: 6
Defense: 2
Life: 6
Points: 180

What, Behind the Rabbit?
If the Rabbit is unengaged, it may not be attacked unless the attacking figure began it's turn adjacent to the Rabbit.

Territorial
The Rabbit may never make leaving engagement attacks, and may only attack figures it was engaged with at the start of its turn. Whenever a non-flying figure moves adjacent to the Rabbit, immediately roll the 20-sided die. If you roll 8-17, that figure receives 1 wound. If you roll 18 or higher, that figure is destroyed.

Mean Streak a Mile Wide
When the Rabbit inflicts a wound with its normal attack, it may attack again. The Rabbit may continue attacking until it does not inflict a wound, but may not attack the same figure more than once.
________________________

First off, I cleaned up the wording on What, Behind the Rabbit?. I agree that "non-adjacent" was redundant. Next, I added the bit to Territorial to include a modified version of Engagement Strike, which I really liked. I did limit it to "non-flying" figures, because I felt like it needed some kind of limitation, and fliers should be able to avoid the leaping sharp pointy teeth fairly easily.

I also included a clause that the Rabbit can only attack figures that began the Rabbit's turn adjacent to it to further accentuate the point that it really is just a guard and won't pursue anyone of Level 4 or below... I mean, that isn't trying to get past it. This gives the opponent's the first chance to attack the Rabbit, provided that they can get past the initial leap of doom when they engage it. And yes - the Rabbit will attack friendly figures with Territorial. It doesn't care who you are - if you come into it's lair, you'll become more bones to look at.

Lastly, I felt that the Rabbit should still be able to jump around and attack anything next to it, so I added Mean Streak to address this. In the movie, he doesn't always kill what he leaps at before he leaps somewhere else, so I allowed him to keep attacking as he inflicts wounds.

EDIT: And yes, TW, that was my original intent. Lamaclown is exactly right.

Balantai January 31st, 2011 01:06 PM

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by killercactus (Post 1328247)
...further accentuate the point that it really is just a guard and won't pursue anyone of Level 4 or below...

I love the Munchkin card game! :D

Balantai February 1st, 2011 01:35 PM

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 
I fear that we might be trying to push too much theme into this card. I think we might be able to accoplish the rabbit's teritorial nature without som many restrictions.

First, I think we should reduce the movement. The reduced movement would show that he very seldom moves far from his cave. He's not really shown as a fast creature until he is one the offensive. Keeping him as an innocent bunny until he's engaged or within range of an attack seems pretty thematic to me.

"What, Behind The Rabbit" is pretty good. I like the them of them having to have to run away from him if they want to attack him with a non-adjacent attack.

Territorial has potential, but currently, I think it is too complicated. There's too much stuff going on in one power. How about:

Territorial
When an opponent's figure becomes engaged with the Rabbit of Caerbannog, roll the 20-sided die. If you roll an 11 - 18, place 1 wound marker on the figure's card. If you roll a 19 or higher, destroy that figure. Figures may only be targetted by Territorial when they first become engaged. The Rabbit of Caerbannog may not make leaving engagement attacks.

For Mean Streak a Mile Wide, I think I'd rather see a Special Attack that allows the rabbit to lunge. That was one of the coolest parts of that scene. I'd like to see you be able to choose and opponent's figure within x spaces and place the rabbit adjacent to him. Attack with the special attack and choose another figure. Maybe up to 3 times and may not attack the same figure twice. The current version just doesn't capture that theme for me.

killercactus February 1st, 2011 02:43 PM

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 
I could definitely switch Mean Streak back to some version of Lunging Sharp Pointy Teeth Special Attack. Maybe something like this:

Range: 3 Attack: 5
Choose a figure whose base is no more than 3 levels higher or lower than the Rabbit's base to attack. After the attack, place the Rabbit on an empty space adjacent to the chosen figure, if able. You may then attack a different figure with LSPTSA. The Rabbit may attack up to 4 different figures with LSPTSA per turn. When moving with LSPTSA, the Rabbit will not take any leaving engagement attacks.

It's kinda wordy though, which is why I didn't do something like this in the first place.

Balantai February 3rd, 2011 11:42 AM

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 
Pointy Teeth Special Attack
Range 1. Attack 4.
Choose an opponent's figure within 3 clear sight spaces of the Rabbit of Caerbannog whose base is no more than 3 levels higher or lower than the Rabbit of Caerbannog's base. Place the Rabbit of Caerbannog on any adjacent empty space and attack the chosen figure. When the Rabbit of Caerbannog attacks with his Pointy Teeth Special Attack, he may attack with Pointy Teeth Special Attack 2 additional times. You may not attack the same figure more than once in the same turn with Pointy Teeth Special Attack.

killercactus February 3rd, 2011 11:53 AM

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 
Does he get to leap again each time? It kinda sounds like he leaps once and then has to stay there and attack 3 times. It also doesn't let him leap from figure to figure unless he kills what he attacks first.

Balantai February 3rd, 2011 11:58 AM

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by killercactus (Post 1331174)
Does he get to leap again each time? It kinda sounds like he leaps once and then has to stay there and attack 3 times. It also doesn't let him leap from figure to figure unless he kills what he attacks first.

Pointy Teeth Special Attack
Range 1. Attack 4.
Choose an opponent's figure within 3 clear sight spaces of the Rabbit of Caerbannog whose base is no more than 3 levels higher or lower than the Rabbit of Caerbannog's base to attack. Place the Rabbit of Caerbannog on any adjacent empty space and attack the chosen figure. When the Rabbit of Caerbannog attacks with uses his Pointy Teeth Special Attack, he may attack with Pointy Teeth Special Attack use it 2 additional times. You may not attack the same figure more than once in the same turn with Pointy Teeth Special Attack.

Does that clarify your concerns?

killercactus February 3rd, 2011 12:17 PM

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 
I think that's ok. Here's an update:

Rabbit of Caerbannog
Monty Python's Quest for the Holy Grail
Valkrill
Unique Hero
Rabbit
Guard
Ferocious
Small 1
Move: 6
Range: 1
Attack: 6
Defense: 2
Life: 6
Points: 180

What, Behind the Rabbit?
If the Rabbit is unengaged, it may not be attacked unless the attacking figure began it's turn adjacent to the Rabbit.

Territorial
The Rabbit may never make leaving engagement attacks. Whenever a figure moves adjacent to the Rabbit, immediately roll the 20-sided die. If you roll 8-18, that figure receives 1 wound. If you roll 19 or higher, that figure is destroyed. Figures may only be targeted as they move into engagement with the Rabbit.

Pointy Teeth Special Attack
Range: Special Attack: 4
Choose an opponent's figure within 3 clear sight spaces of the Rabbit of Caerbannog whose base is no more than 3 levels higher or lower than the Rabbit's base to attack. Place the Rabbit on any adjacent empty space and attack the chosen figure. When the Rabbit of Caerbannog uses his Pointy Teeth Special Attack, he may use it 2 additional times. You may not attack the same figure more than once in the same turn with Pointy Teeth Special Attack. When moving using Pointy Teeth Special Attack, the Rabbit never takes leaving engagement attacks.


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