Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Regarding the Question mini you have there, just want to warn you that that's the female Question mini. I got screwed on that one when I ordered a bunch, thinking they were the male. Here's the one you want:

http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/m...1/HDOR_034.jpg

It's pretty easy to pry the pillar off of that base.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Thanks for the heads-up.

So, is this project still going on?

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

From what I can glean from the Wiki and the comments here, Sullivan's power level is tied to how many "friendlies" are nearby. I'd like to see each of his abilities be weak unless he has his support group.

I like the 2nd version of Manipulation better, but I think it should allow you to take a turn with an opposing figure. Manipulation is all about getting someone to do something they wouldn't normally do. Taking a turn with a friendly unit doesn't sound manipulative. I could see a d20 roll with +1 or +2 for each friendly hero within 3 spaces.

I really like that sinkhole idea in Terrakinesis...:whistle:
However, 4 to 7 sinkholes in a row from one attack is overkill, IMO. I would suggest the "fireline" version be more like Sullivan sending out a shockwave that affects every one in that line (I think Machineking suggested something like this) without the lasting terrain effect. The other option would be to target 1 opponent with a sinkhole and then allow the attack to affect 1 additional adjacent opposing figure for each "friendly" adjacent to Sullivan. It could still end up being a powerful area attack but only if you're able to maneuver your forces to keep the heroes together.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Just in case anyone is still interested...

Good ideas, mac.

Samuel's manipulation in the series was actually directed more towards his friends than anyone else. He was very good at getting them to do things for him they didn't really want to do. I agree, we typically wouldn't think of needong to manipulate friends but that is pretty much how Samuel did it.

I like your ideas for Terrakinesis. So...

Samuel Sullivan
HUMAN
UNIQUE HERO
LEADER
RUTHLESS
VYDAR

LIFE 5
MOVE 5
RANGE 1
ATTACK 2
DEFENSE 2

TERRAKINESIS SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 6. Attack 2.
Choose an opponent’s figure within 6 clear sight spaces of Samuel Sullivan. For each friendly figure adjacent to Samuel, 1 additional figure adjacent to the chosen figure is affected by Terrakinesis Special Attack. Add 1 attack die to Terrakinesis Special Attack for each friendly figure adjacent to Samuel to a maximum of 4 attack dice. Roll Attack dice once for all affected figures. Figures roll defense separately. If a figure is not destroyed by Terrakinesis Special Attack, it must roll for falling damage.

MANIPULATION
Instead of taking a turn with Samuel Sullivan you may either take a turn with any unique hero you control within sight of Samuel or move any 1 figure within 3 clear sight spaces of Samuel up to 3 spaces. A figure moved with manipulation cannot be moved onto a lava space.

Any more thoughts? Anyone still reading this...;)

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

I would change Terrakinesis so it had a maxium of five attack die, but is only fueled by Unique Heroes. Otherwise, its too easy to surround him with Rats.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Yes, heroes only (also very thematic). Also, shouldn't flying figures be immune from the falling damage?


Side note: Sorry I haven't posted much lately. Real life has been hectic - busy, long work-hours, 3 kids and the wife in school, etc, etc, etc...

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

The bolded part alone is enough to keep a mortal man busy for life. You deserve to have a HS hero made after you ;)

Limiting it to heroes is a good idea. I didn't think of flying figs, but yes, they shouldn't have to roll for falling damage. I'll post the new and improved Samuel later tonight.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

OK, it was later than last night but here it is...

Samuel Sullivan
HUMAN
UNIQUE HERO
LEADER
RUTHLESS
VYDAR

LIFE 5
MOVE 5
RANGE 1
ATTACK 2
DEFENSE 2

TERRAKINESIS SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 6. Attack 2.
Choose an opponent’s figure within 6 clear sight spaces of Samuel Sullivan. For each friendly unique hero adjacent to Samuel, 1 additional figure adjacent to the chosen figure is affected by Terrakinesis Special Attack. Add 1 attack die to Terrakinesis Special Attack for each friendly unique hero adjacent to Samuel to a maximum of 4 attack dice. Roll Attack dice once for all affected figures. Figures roll defense separately. If a figure is not destroyed by Terrakinesis Special Attack, it must roll for falling damage.
Flying figures do not have to roll for falling damage.

MANIPULATION
Instead of taking a turn with Samuel Sullivan you may either take a turn with any unique hero you control within sight of Samuel or move any 1 figure within 3 clear sight spaces of Samuel up to 3 spaces. A figure moved with manipulation cannot be moved onto a lava space.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Sorry, long time lurker, been watching the magic unfold.

I would love to see the custom of mac122 (not in this thread though!).

:lol:

CRC

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Looks good to me.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Okay. All this time off should've weeded out those people that were only semi-interested in this thread. Let's hope there are still people left that are intersted. :D

Changes suggested above.

I'm not really sold on either of these two powers. They both seem overly complicated. Personally, I think I'd like to see Manipulation just have the turn with a Unique Hero you control. Also, I'd like to see Terrakinesis simplified a bit. I'm not sure if the additional falling damage is really necessary.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

You can count me as still in :)

Manipulation was originally Master Manipulator a la Red Skull which does affect only unique heroes you control. I am ok with going back to that.

As far as Terrakinesis, I am good with removing the extra falling damage in order to simplify things. Do you think that maybe upping the maximum number of possible attack dice to 5 would be ok then?

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

I think I'd like to see it go back to Master Manipulator.

For Terrakenisis, how about:

TERRAKINESIS SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 6. Attack 2 + Special.
All figures within 2 spaces of the targeted figure or destuctible object are also affected by Terrakinesis Special Attack. You may roll 1 additional attack die for each friendly unique hero adjacent to Samuel Sullivan to a maximum of 5 additional attack dice. Roll Attack dice once for all affected figures and destuctibe objects. Figures roll defense dice separately. Destructibe objects may not roll defense dice. If you roll at least 3 skulls when attacking with Terrakinesis Special Attack, you may move all affected figures up to 3 spaces. Figures do not take leaving engagement attacks when moved due to Terrakinesis Special Attack.

I added some complexity, but also removed some. What do you think?

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

I really like the stipulations about destructible objects! The castle door doesn't seem nearly as daunting. It would also mean you could affect figs behind the door as well- very cool. Hmmm... would it affect shooters above the door as well? That would be cool.
I like it!

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

I'm still here, too. I agree with Balantai's suggestions.
I think it should be able to. I don't think you'd have to add any thing in unless you want to add a height restriction "up to 20 levels above" or something like that.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Samuel Sullivan
HUMAN
UNIQUE HERO
LEADER
RUTHLESS
VYDAR

LIFE 5
MOVE 5
RANGE 1
ATTACK 2
DEFENSE 2

MASTER MANIPULATOR
After revealing an Order Marker on this card and instead of taking a turn with Samuel Sullivan you may take a turn with any unique hero you control within clear sight of Samuel Sullivan.

TERRAKINESIS SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 6. Attack 2 + Special.
All figures within 2 spaces of the targeted figure or destuctible object are also affected by Terrakinesis Special Attack. You may roll 1 additional attack die for each friendly unique hero adjacent to Samuel Sullivan to a maximum of 5 additional attack dice. Roll Attack dice once for all affected figures and destuctibe objects. Figures roll defense dice separately. Destructibe objects may not roll defense dice. Samuel Sullivan can not be affected by his own Terrakinesis Special Attack. If you roll at least 3 skulls when attacking with Terrakinesis Special Attack, you may move all affected figures up to 3 spaces. Figures do not take leaving engagement attacks when moved due to Terrakinesis Special Attack.

COST: 150

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

I could see removing the 5 die maximum. Besides, is there really that much of a difference between 5 dice and 6 dice. Also, how often will there be six unique heroes surrounding Sullivan?

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

EDIT: Wow, I didn't realize I worked on this post so long until I saw that Balantai had posted twice while I was working on this...

It is a good thing we simplified some. This all barely fits on a card and that is at a 10 point size font- but fit it does.

If there is no other input on this, how about cost?

Master Manipulator alone is a good enough reason for me to draft him as it greatly simplifies OMs on your heroes (I use Red Skull often because of it; I even do well with him). However, once all of your heroes are destroyed, he loses quite a bit of affectiveness.

Terrakinesis, when used strategically will wreak some havoc. It has the potential to affect up to 19 figures. It can be especially useful in storm-the-castle type games (if he can survive long enough to get to the castle door).

Low defense and attack, and average life for a hero bring his cost down.

Looking at Red Skull:
Life 5
Move 5
Range 5
Attack 4
Defense 3

Manipulator + Insta kill ability

Cost: 190

Looking at Samuel:
Life 5 (match)
Move 5 (match)
Range 1 (but has ranged special with +1 range over Red Skull)
Attack 2 (but ranged special can affect multiple figures; also, as a special attack, his range attack bypasses some defensive abilities which Red Skull's can't; advantage I think goes to Samuel)
Defense 2 (Red Skull has the advantage)

Manipulator + Mass affect special attack

?Cost: 160 (I think the difference between 2 defense and 3 defense is greater than it appears on paper)

My first estimate was between 110-120 but after comparing him to Red Skull he is more powerful than I first thought. A Defense of 2 was a good idea.

Take this with a grain of salt. We are moving into my weakest area in custom making.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

I think the cost could come down even a bit more. If you're utilizing Master Manipulator, you're potentially weakening your own Special Attack. I would put him at about 130.

EDIT: In addition, I needed to add "Samuel Sullivan can not be affected by his own Terrakinesis Special Attack." to the Special Power. I hope it still fits on the card.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

I'm all about lowering points when possible.
As far as fitting on the card, at first I couldn't get it to fit. Then I realized it was one of the old card templates. All the newer cards have an extended ability text area plus they got rid of the swoosh at the bottom to give even more ability text area. With some work I was able to get it all to fit. If we departed from total officialness and referred to him as simply Samuel in the ability texts and dropped the Sullivan we could pick up some space (although it wouldn't sound as good).

Also, is there a shorter way to spell "Terrakinesis Special Attack"? ;)

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Actually, I believe there is some official precedence for this. The Incredible Hulk often reference Hulk in the power text. It always address him as Incredible Hulk the first time in a power, but all futher references in the power reference Hulk.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Point wise, by looking the card, I'd place him in the 170-180 range. Terrakinesis is a retty powerful attack, more powerful than Queglix on certain maps, I daresay. The only other unit with a ranged attack that strong is the Roman Archers of their special attack of 6. Like the Roman Archers' special attack, Sullivan's attack is somewhat circumstantial, but If you use a hero-heavy army, it can and will be very powerful.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

I don't have any cards in front of me here at work...wow, wouldn't it be fun if my job entailed having Heroscape cards...anyway, but I believe on some cards, after the first reference to a Special Attack in the text, they drop the words "Special Attack" in later references. If so, that would eliminate about 28 characters from the text:

Edit: of course the first card I find in the gallery does not support my theory. I'll look through some tonight and see if I was dreaming about that

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

The only reason I think he would be less than that is because of his 2 defense and 5 life. His worth definitely increases as you increase the total points of your army. One on one he's almost worthless, but in a crowd he's devastating.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Well I said 130 and Machinekng says 180 so let's meet in the middle at 150 and push him to the playtesting thread.

EDIT:
Lamaclown,

Can you post what mini you'd like to use for Sullivan?

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Granite,

Go ahead and make you chioce and post it in the correct format. The correct format is listed on the original post.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

http://i894.photobucket.com/albums/a...man021-MKU.jpg

Corwin
Literature: The Amber Chronicles
Vydar

Amberite
Unique Hero
Prince
Tricky
Size: Medium 5

Life: 6
Move: 5
Range: 1
Attack: 4
Defense: 4

ROYALTY
Before taking a turn with Corwin, you may first take a turn with any Amberite Prince or Amberite Princess you control.

TRUMP CARD 15
After moving, if Corwin is not engaged, you may roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 15 or higher, you may place one Amberite figure you control adjacent to Corwin. If the Amberite figure was engaged, it will not take any leaving engagement attacks.

GRAYSWANDIR
When attacking an adjacent figure that has a Tricky, Wild, or Tormented personality, you may roll 2 additional attack dice.

Points: 180

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

I agree with you here, but with the prevalence of cheaper uncommon heroes, his presence becomes more and more devastating. 150 seems fair for now, though.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

150 sounds like a good place to start. Let's send Samuel Sullivan to playtesting. Nice work Lamaclown and all who contributed.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Here is a card I just made for use for playtesting. If anyone wants me to, I can make some of the others.

http://i1227.photobucket.com/albums/...kle/CORWIN.jpg

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Good work

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Sorry to take so long to respond. I was pretty much on the go the entire weekend. For once I am glad for Monday.

I have scoured the miniature galleries for just about every game I can think of. I wanted to choose a mini that was actually accessible to people who can't afford to pay $10 for one figure.

The one I will probably use for myself (with a little repaint and some minor head modding) is this one of the Joker...
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/c...lsullivan1.jpghttp://i219.photobucket.com/albums/c...lsullivan2.jpg
With a little less modding you could go with this one...
http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/m...1/HDOR_034.jpg

It is The Question from heroclix. The first version picked turned out to be a female- please don't tell my wife I couldn't tell the difference :shock: This is the male version of that fig. Granite-M said it isn't difficult to remove the pillar behind the figure.

If anyone has a better idea for a readily available figure please let me know- at this point I won't be too picky.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

The only objection I have with using The Question as your mini, is that it is the one I picked for Dr. Who. :twisted:

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

You still around these parts, Granite? ;)

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

I guess the good Dr. and Samuel could duke it out for fig rights ;) (althoug I fear poor Samuel wouldn't pass muster against the Dr.)

I did have 2 other figs picked but they didn't quite fit the bill either...
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/c...lsullivan3.jpghttp://i219.photobucket.com/albums/c...lsullivan4.jpg
Black King and Ringmaster respectively; both from Heroclix.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

I actually like both of those choices.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

How about something a little more up-to-date - just not into the tails or the hat.
http://i894.photobucket.com/albums/a...tuff/bruce.jpg
Bruce Wayne available from Miniature Market for $1. Brave and the Bold set.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Name: Frankenstein's Monster
Genre: Literature
Miniature: Horrorclix Base Set #87 The Fiend (Possibly)
http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/m...1/HORBS-87.jpg

Character Information: Frankenstein's monster

Direction: Looking at creating a unit with some good punch, but that suffers from being around human beings. Frankenstein's monster was a beast, but he seemed to get undone by how afraid people were of him, and vice versa. So...

1) Strong attack
2) Solid defense
3) Vulnerability to being around humans

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Frankenstein's Monster
Vydar

Creature
Unique Hero
Beast or Construct
Tormented
???

Life 5
Move 4
Range 1
Attack 5
Defense 5
Points ???

Indomitable
If Frankenstein's Monster begins its turn unengaged, you may add 2 to its move value this turn. If Frankenstein's Monster begins its turn engaged, you may add 2 to its attack value this turn.

Heartbroken
If there is a Human figure within 4 spaces of Frankenstein's Monster, subtract 2 from Frankenstein's Monster's defense value.


Uses the new Frost Giant's power to strengthen the monster, while Heartbroken provides an Achilles's heel.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Nice choice, Granite.

+1 Attack and -1 Defense against humans maybe?


Creator Bonding
At the start of the game, choose an opponent's unique hero to be the Monster's Creator. When within X clear sight spaces of the Creator, Frankenstien's Monster rolls 2 additional attack dice. If the chosen Creator is destroyed, Frankenstein's Monster rolls 2 less defense dice.

I like the figure, too.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Awesome choice, Granite.

There's another Heroclix choice for mini, also.

http://www.gamehollow.com/catalog/im...c/dc/aa041.jpg

The sword doesn't really fit, but it's so easy to cut off that even if someone didn't have a utility knife, they could probably use a pair of scissors.

Also, I wouldn't mind seeing Frankenstein having an aversion to fire.

I could see Frankenstein with high stats but multilple Special Powers that lower those stats based on his fears. Also, you could probably make his fear of humans also effect the humans. Afterall, they're just as afraid of him.

I could see him with 4 movement. He's not one known to be running much.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

As far as the figure for Samuel Sullivan...


Frankenstein's Monster should be fun.

A fear of fire is definitely thematic but wording it would be the difficult part.

I like machinekng's suggestions for his stats. Here are my thoughts...

FRANKENSTEIN'S MONSTER

VYDAR
UNDEAD
UNIQUE HERO
CONSTRUCT
TERRIFYING

LIFE 5
MOVE 4
RANGE 1
ATTACK 5
DEFENSE 5 or 6

HUMAN MOB
Subtract 1 from Frankenstein's Monster's attack and defense for each Human figure adjacent to him to a maximum of 3 less dice each.

Not really sure how to word the last part. basically he loses up to 3 dice from his attack and defense depending on how many humans are around him.

INSERT ANOTHER COOL ABILITY HERE
This is where the text of another cool ability would go.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

That mini is perfect for Sam Sullivan. Nice find, Lamaclown.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

This is the wording I used for my NM24 Martian Manhunter. It could work well enough...
FIRE WEAKNESS
If Frankenstein's Monster is on a molten lava or lava field space, he rolls 3 fewer defense dice.
Clean, simple and to the point, n'est pas? ;)

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Oui, simple and thematic. I was referring to fire-based attacks though. I don't know of any way to refer to fire based attacks simply since nothing exists in official language for them..

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

Which is why this works so well. It translates a vulnerability that does not exist in this game yet into terms that do exist. It is also implied that he is weak against fire-based attacks, but that is up to the individual players to decide. Of course, the other option is to do what I did with a few of my other customs...
Figures with Fire Vulnerability roll 3 less defense dice against Firefly's Flamethrower Special Attack.
But that is not a necessity, just a suggestion.
</IMG>

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

I currently do this on all my superhero customs. It works very well. It doesn't mix with Vahallascape, but contained within it's own set, it works perfectly.

Re: Heroes of Fiction: Design Thread
 

It's all you, Granite. Let's see that draft.