Heroscapers
Go Back   Heroscapers > Blogs > A Knight's Tale-The blog of S1R_ART0R1US


Random opinions, strategies and whatever else I decide to put up here.
Rate this Entry

One new wave and suddenly everybody wants to be a hero

Posted July 21st, 2010 at 04:18 PM by S1R_ART0R1US
Updated July 21st, 2010 at 04:33 PM by S1R_ART0R1US
Chomp! There are very few HeroScape players who have not experienced the pure joy of using Grimnak to consistently clear the board of pesky squads members, whether busting through a rat screen-ew- or getting rid of those annoying Krav. RotV also introduced us to dragons, with Braxas as one of the strongest, with Mattser taking her to first place in last year’s GenCon. And nobody could forget the controversy caused by Zelrig, whose existence seemed to be to wipe out common swarms. What do these three figures have in common?

They hate elementals and wyrmlings. Seriously, they do.

Elementals are common heroes, yet with Kurrok they behave like a common squad, as you can take a turn with any three elementals (within 8 clear sight spaces) instead of him. Wyrmlings behave similarly, as you can take turns with any two of them, with half of the wyrmlings possessing multiple attacks. And these guys are somewhat cheap too, at around 30 points per unit, less than the cost of a Krav. Their bonding offers greater flexibility than squads, as you can select whatever combination you want.

Facing a Gilbert backed KoW? Use a red wyrmling to take out the KoW and put some wounds on Gilbert with a black wyrmling. Up against Reavers? Throw a double dose of fire on them with two red wyrmlings. Use fire elementals to screen for water elementals because if you lose a fire elemental, you can just move one up while still attacking with ranged water elementals.

These bonding groups represent what I think we’ll be seeing a lot of in the DnD waves-common heroes who act like squads. The problem is that they’re not to units like Grimnak and Braxas whose powers specifically target squads. Their special powers are less effective because it takes the same d20 roll to kill these cheap common heroes as it does to kill 100+ point powerhouses like Mogrimm and Sergeant Drake. Zelrig isn’t impacted as much as he doesn’t roll the d20, but that minus 2 defense dice against common squads would really help, as the chance of killing them is 75% with one defense die and 50.9% with three, or 62.5% with two and 40.7% with four.

These new common heroes really put a damper on playing figures like Braxas, as they’re a big point investment and wyrmling/elemental builds like the Firestorm supported by dok make them next to useless. Perhaps this is good though, as Heavies builds have been seeing a rise in popularity as a counter to rats while Matthias and mapmakers like GameBear and Dignan have lead the charge in making melee more viable, and Braxas is busy frying agents and heroes like Kaemon Awa and Raelin, as well as thinning hordes of knights and stingers.

The metagame has been/is going to be shaken up by the DnD waves with new figures that challenge old strategies (you can move me off height-what?!) and bolster certain builds (hello Darklord Bonding) while introducing new concepts (shadow tiles wherever I want them…hmmm) and hurt some figures as I’ve outlined here, but that’s what happens as the game ages and changes. Maybe it's a return to HeroScape, just with weaker heroes.


But all I really know is that I still love to Chomp!
Total Comments 15

Comments

Old
Very interesting. I always like to remind myself when building armies that figures like the Wyrmlings and Elementals aren't (as) affected by things like Chomp or Poison Acid Breath, but I never really stopped to consider the effect that all of this could have on the competitive metagame.

I stress "could" because it's all just theoryscape at the moment. Maybe every other person that brings a Wyrmling army to a tournament will get completely destroyed. In that case, I wouldn't be particularly wary of bringing Braxas or Grimnak to a tournament.

But these armies do look good on paper. So I think that at least in the short term, we won't see a lot of Braxas or Zelrig or anything at tournaments. After all, as I said above, these are untested forces. Maybe these would just be a complete disaster for a Zelrig army. Or maybe it won't be so bad. But I certainly wouldn't take the risk when there are so many other great figures or armies to try out. I bet a lot of others won't too.

Further in the future, it is anyone's guess. It all depends on how good these Wyrmling and Elemental builds turn out to be. If they perform well and they become a pretty common sight at tournaments, you can bet that Braxas etc.'s popularity will decline slightly.


So, I think that in the immediate short-term, like Gencon and the next month or two, those figures will certainly see a fair bit less tournament play. After that, though, I doubt we will see anything more than a very slight decline in their popularity.
Posted July 21st, 2010 at 06:00 PM by Warlord Alpha Warlord Alpha is offline
Old
S1R_ART0R1US's Avatar
Yeah, I don't see wrymlings being an armyin itself, but rather a component, like stingers or KA.
Posted July 21st, 2010 at 06:03 PM by S1R_ART0R1US S1R_ART0R1US is offline
Old
True. But there are two ways to end up Wyrmlings in your army - either base your army around them from the start, or use them as part of another army as you said.

If you wanted to base an army around them, they almost have what it takes to be an entire army, it's just that they are missing a big attack and a good way to stay on glyphs. The thing about the lack of a big attack is that what supplies those big attacks is heroes - aka, the kinds of figures that are equally unaffected by Chomp or Acid Breath. The glyph thing calls for common squads, but one or two squads of whatever is much less targets for Acid Breath than a whole army of them.
Posted July 21st, 2010 at 06:35 PM by Warlord Alpha Warlord Alpha is offline
Old
ABOMINATION's Avatar
Simply defeat Kurrock, and you have a bunch of elementals milling around waiting to be slaughtered, IMO.

As WA said, these figs are not yet tested completely, and for the Elementals to be a viable tourney army, we'll have to see how Kurrock can stand up to the various tried and true armies that are out there.

BTW, nice blog.
Posted July 21st, 2010 at 06:48 PM by ABOMINATION ABOMINATION is offline
Old
Pickledpie's Avatar
Quote:
Simply defeat Kurrock
One does not simply defeat Kurrock.

You need ninjas.... and, wizards... NINJA WIZARDS!!!!1!!1
Posted July 21st, 2010 at 07:29 PM by Pickledpie Pickledpie is offline
Old
S1R_ART0R1US's Avatar
One cannot simply walk into Mordor!
Posted July 21st, 2010 at 07:31 PM by S1R_ART0R1US S1R_ART0R1US is offline
Old
ABOMINATION's Avatar
Quote:
One cannot simply walk into Mordor!
Darn it, why didn't you spell it 'Mortor'?

...Pickledpie, it might be a little tough, but going for Kurrock would be much, much wiser than slamming your army against the Elementals first.
Posted July 21st, 2010 at 07:38 PM by ABOMINATION ABOMINATION is offline
Old
Sujoah's Avatar
Quote:
...Pickledpie, it might be a little tough, but going for Kurrock would be much, much wiser than slamming your army against the Elementals first.
Yes, but if you have mostly small and mediums, going after Kurrok can be a huge pain if there's a few Air Elementals.
Posted July 21st, 2010 at 08:43 PM by Sujoah Sujoah is offline
Old
ABOMINATION's Avatar
Quote:
Yes, but if you have mostly small and mediums, going after Kurrok can be a huge pain if there's a few Air Elementals.
Air Elementals can be taken care of with a few attacks from a dragon or basically anyone with a ranged attack.

I think that the biggest worries in the Elemental department would be the Fire Elemental, followed by the Water Elemental.
Posted July 21st, 2010 at 08:59 PM by ABOMINATION ABOMINATION is offline
Old
Heroscape Elffy's Avatar
Artorius?! He's back?!

(No, this comment does not pertain to ANYTHING that you said in your blog)
Posted July 21st, 2010 at 10:44 PM by Heroscape Elffy Heroscape Elffy is offline
Old
S1R_ART0R1US's Avatar
Yeah, now that school's out for the summer I stopped being a lurker and started posting.
Posted July 22nd, 2010 at 02:10 PM by S1R_ART0R1US S1R_ART0R1US is offline
Old
Jexik's Avatar
I'd actually think the opposite, Warlord Alpha.

I think that in the immediate short-term (at GenCon, etc), most people will stick to the units that they know well, rather than jump on board these new Common Hero armies like the Elementals and Wyrmlings.

Quote:
So, I think that in the immediate short-term, like Gencon and the next month or two, those figures will certainly see a fair bit less tournament play. After that, though, I doubt we will see anything more than a very slight decline in their popularity.
Overall, I think it's a pretty interesting point though, Sir Artorius. Grimnak and the others certainly don't like these sorts of units. Whether or not that's enough to affect how much play Grimnak and Braxas see play is another matter entirely.
Posted July 25th, 2010 at 12:53 AM by Jexik Jexik is offline
Updated July 25th, 2010 at 12:59 AM by Jexik
Old
S1R_ART0R1US's Avatar
I thought they had a nice solution with the Black Wyrmling by doing damage instead of autokill, but against soulborg heroes (especially the DWs), autowounds do serious damage.
Posted July 25th, 2010 at 03:07 AM by S1R_ART0R1US S1R_ART0R1US is offline
Old
kolakoski's Avatar

Now that I've actually played them . . .

I had to come up with an Einar build at 510 points recently in a six-player, three team game, and came up with

180 Red Wyrmlings x 6
120 Kaemon
110 Ninjas of the Northern Wind
100 Kozuke
510

My end game play left something to be desired, but my Wyrmlings killed way more than their points in Granite Guardians, Sasquatches, Aubriens, and Gladiatrons, while also wounding Raelin. Perfect compliments to the Samurai or any army afraid of being swarmed/shot up by commons. If I had the cash to lay down, I'd bet on them to figure prominently in the tournament scene in the near future, probably combined with Phantom Knights, in the 150-210 point range, as a major component of a balanced army.
Posted August 15th, 2010 at 01:52 PM by kolakoski kolakoski is offline
Old
Tornado's Avatar
Great Blog S1R. I do believe that D&D is putting the Hero back in HS. The treasure glyphs are a big boost. The other thing I like is that in D2 all cards have a base range of 1 with just a few with SA of range 3-5. More hand to hand and more Heroes, I love it. One thing though, the BW's breath weapon will not work on DW9 and DW8 for they are large and the BW's SA only works on small or medium. peace
Posted August 22nd, 2010 at 01:08 PM by Tornado Tornado is offline
 
Recent Blog Entries by S1R_ART0R1US

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:01 PM.

Heroscape background footer

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.