HeroScape is coming back!

[wriggz]

I hope so too, nothing turns heads like a legion of Romans lead by an alien backed by a dragon, or a few squads of elven archers backed by samurai and a giant robot. That said I would temper your expectations.

[Sherman Davies]

Originally Posted by TerminX

DEI madness? lmao take it back to 4chan mate

Sometimes I wonder whether people who hear the words "diversity" "equity" and "inclusion" and think that those are qualities that must be resisted and fought realize just how much they sound like mustache-twirling supervillains.

[Master Roshi]

I want any historical figures to be accurate to the culture that they actually had, but the more pressure we put on it, the more the developers are going to feel backed into a corner without any wiggle room because they're afraid of doing something that will unintentionally offend someone. So far, Heroscape hasn't done anything that is blatantly wrong or innapropriate.
Since the cards contain such little information on them, I don't think there is much to worry about. All they have to do is make the figures match the clothing/armor of the time and make sure not to say something ridiculous in the few sentences the card has

[Shurrig]

Originally Posted by TerminX

jm2c but i get the feeling AoA focused on new factions to put people on a more even playing field - so new players didnt feel like half the synergies for their favorite figs from the starter set are a decade or more out of print. I figure more of that stuff would've been added eventually, like the grut war mammoth

that's just speculation though. and it doesn't really apply to historicals

I wanna touch back on this, because I think it's a pretty good point and probably couldn't say it much better myself. I figured we'd get these historical and classic units in their own unit packs, and that the master set option would be an addition to old fans and good starting point for new ones. I think it'd be pretty foolish to say, hide the SotM 5 behind a $100+ master set instead of selling them separately, and they'd probably do that for a lot of figures that would be more desirable for older fans.

[Sherman Davies]

Originally Posted by Master Roshi

Since the cards contain such little information on them, I don't think there is much to worry about. All they have to do is make the figures match the clothing/armor of the time and make sure not to say something ridiculous in the few sentences the card has

True, there's not a ton of information and text on a card, but one thing to be sensitive to is a historical unit's Valkyrie general. It was the subject that probably stirred up the most debate during the development of C3V's Civil War units.

[wriggz]

It also worth noting that ninjas as portraied in heroscape never existed, it's a modern day creation much like king Arthur's knights or Robin hood's merry men. What we have in heroscape is more similar to D&D classes than anything historical. Hell the old west figures are trops themselves.

[Bonesaw]

Originally Posted by Sherman Davies

Sometimes I wonder whether people who hear the words "diversity" "equity" and "inclusion" and think that those are qualities that must be resisted and fought realize just how much they sound like mustache-twirling supervillains.

I can assure you that in many ways as someone who has significant experience with it, especially in the workplace, elements within DEI are quite dubious at best and more than subject to scrutiny.

[Tauros105]

Personally, I'm not worried about Heroscape going into "DEI madness" because I'm a grown adult who isn't made insecure by a company trying to make sure they get representation correct. Praying for ya'll though.

[Master Roshi]

Originally Posted by Sherman Davies

True, there's not a ton of information and text on a card, but one thing to be sensitive to is a historical unit's Valkyrie general. It was the subject that probably stirred up the most debate during the development of C3V's Civil War units.

That's a good point

[ThrasherDarkrai]

Originally Posted by Tauros105

Personally, I'm not worried about Heroscape going into "DEI madness" because I'm a grown adult who isn't made insecure by a company trying to make sure they get representation correct. Praying for ya'll though.

100% this.

Relevantly, AoA did not lack historical units simply because Avalon Hill wanted to get representation correct. The real issue, in my cynical view, was one of overall direction. Encarmine stated, in an interview later in the crowdfund's lifespan, that AH wanted to create more "unique" factions for IP purposes, and that's plainly visible in the almost-total absence of historical (or historically-themed) units in the Dawn Raiders. BigTicket got it exactly right earlier in this thread (relevant portion bolded for emphasis):

Originally Posted by BigTicket

I think the issue of cultural sensitivity makes the decision to lump pirates into the dawnraider syndicate in AoA even more puzzling. Pirates seem like one of the safest options to provide a historical faction that is unlikely to ruffle many feathers.

I said this at the time, but if Avalon Hill had wanted to include, say, the actual Anne Bonny, they could have easily done so. No nation or people lays claim to her (so her inclusion would be highly unlikely to offend anyone), and the historical Anne Bonny literally disappears from the annals of history, so it'd be simple to justify her showing up on Valhalla. Instead, Avalon Hill included a "nod" to Anne Bonny donning a predator mask. If the issue was just that Avalon Hill wanted to make sure they got representation right (and, to be clear, putting in the effort to represent historical groups accurately and respectfully is great!), the Dawn Raiders nonetheless provided opportunities to include historical figures that would be "unlikely to ruffle many feathers" (as BigTicket puts it above) while they worked on conducting the requisite research to include other historical factions people wanted. The fact that Avalon Hill didn't take them shows they simply did not prioritize the inclusion of historical units, even when opportunities to include them presented themselves.

[Master Roshi]

I just don't want the developers to be painted as rude or unethical if they get some small detail incorrect, or leave out some detail of a historical unit that should have been included. Not being an expert in a particular culture isn't some slight or disrespect against that culture.
They still should do their best to accurately represent the people they're pulling from, because the entire purpose of Heroscape is that it isn't homogeneous in the units you can play with.

[Master Roshi]

If we want to expand Jandar's historical units without adding more Americans and Northern Europeans, then I think adding some Sikh/Punjabi warriors would be cool. This would also help to work against the trope of just using Einar as the place where all historical figures are dumped