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  #37  
Old March 3rd, 2011, 06:12 PM
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Re: When rights are taken too far.

<likely my only post in this thread and more or less my 2cents>

I am not in any way religious
I am more or less Pro-Speech
I am more or less Pro-Revolt
(and) I am Pro-War(all of which these points I think is something to make note of assuming anybody even bothers to read through this)

Please don't wave your flags at me, I don't want to see it. And please don't make your chanting at me, for I don't want to hear it. Now remember, I did not say NOT TO, I merely asked for you to go away. I know I cannot stop you, wipe you from the face of the planet, warp you to the middle of Crusades where you may belong. But, if nothing else, I do ask you to respect my wishes. I am respecting your wishes in telling you to continue your protesting. So to summarize...EITHER SHUT YOUR TRAPS OR GO SOMEWHERE ELSE.

</likely my only post in this thread and more or less my 2cents>

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Last edited by flameslayer93; March 3rd, 2011 at 06:13 PM. Reason: Good on those biker-folks however:)
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  #38  
Old March 3rd, 2011, 06:40 PM
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Re: When rights are taken too far.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greyelephant View Post
Given by what I seen in this thread http://www.heroscapers.com/community...ad.php?t=34871 it seems that in certain cases people can be removed from public places where ferderal employees are speaking.
Yeah, I saw the connection to the other thread too.

That's why in one of my earlier posts I emphasized that freedom of speech applies to people in *public* places. It doesn't matter who's speaking, you have a right to freedom of speech when you are on the proverbial sidewalk or in the proverbial public square.

I can wave banners and stomp up and down the sidewalk in front of the Rite Aid, the moment I step through those sliding doors and I'm staring at piles of generic cold medicine and chewing gum I better watch my mouth, because they can throw me out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by delphic View Post
Pointing out specific acts of these groups and holding them responsible is the only way to fight them.

I hope you understand my motivations a bit better. What exactly are your again?
"These groups"? What groups? PETA and your mythical dozen? Delphic, please list which groups you're talking about besides PETA. You said a dozen. Ok, list them. A dozen groups like Westboro Baptist Church, when all you've said is PETA + a dozen more and PETA is demonstrably different from them. But I want to know what the other 12 environmental groups are, anyway.

My motivation is that I don't like to see ugly smearing on these boards. Now you know my motivation.

Now I want to see your list.

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Last edited by Dad_Scaper; March 3rd, 2011 at 06:45 PM.
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  #39  
Old March 3rd, 2011, 08:01 PM
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Re: When rights are taken too far.

1: Native Forest Action
2: Green Peace
3: Earth First
4: Earth Liberation Front
5: American Lands Alliance
6: Animal Liberation Front
7: The Sea Shepherd Conservation Society
8: The Coalition to Save the Preserves.
9: Hardesty Avengers
10: The Earth Liberation Army
11: Environmental Life Force
12: SHAC - Actually desecrates graves and steal remains to intimidate CEOs.

That is the list the crimes vary from tree spiking, setting fires, building bombs, ramming coast guard vessels and fishing boats, all in the name of extremist environmentalism.

Most have been convicted or accused of Domestic or Eco Terrorism. They don't show up at funerals or pick on families, they just kill people and destroy lives.

I'll let you peruse the wealth of information on these groups and their crimes at your leisure Sir. Have a nice Day.

Just so I'm perfectly clear here, my original point is: Extremism is extremism and militant tactics are militant tactics, this Baptist Group is only one group, the problem is much bigger than that.

There are others not related to environmental or animal rights groups.

There are over a hundred independent hate groups in the United States, I could list those too. This is a problem that is becoming Epic in the North America, and eventually something will need to be done to stop and prevent it.

Cheers,

Delphic

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  #40  
Old March 3rd, 2011, 08:06 PM
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Re: When rights are taken too far.

Ok, Dephic. This thread was about Westboro Baptist Church and hate speech at funerals.

This is a list of groups you don't like for various reasons, some of which may be perfectly good. But we both know it has nothing to do with Westboro Baptist Church and hate speech at funerals.

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  #41  
Old March 3rd, 2011, 08:07 PM
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Re: When rights are taken too far.

I think the major difference between us is that You want to focus on one group, while I want to look at extremist activities in general as being the root cause to this particular issue and many more.

Edit: After sending a PM, I now understand that the issue was my singling out of environmental groups. That was unfortunately not my intention but rather to give examples of some groups I thought were extremist like the current group of Hate Mongers for which this thread was written. I should have been much broader in my description of extremist because we see it in all major issues. Politics, Religion, Sex, anything you spell with an 'ism etc.

Although I see the boy's death exploited by PETA or the theft of bodies as emotional terrorism by SHAC as similar they are not in the same realm of bottom feeders. They are more "light surface sludge suckers", rather than the "deep slime sucking scum eating bottom feeders" represented by this particular Quasi Religious Hate group.

I apologize for any insult incurred during this misunderstanding. Especially to Dad_Scaper, a member I have grown to respect having witnessed some of his good thoughts and ideas over the past several years.

The idea of being Anti-Environmentalist was so Foreign to me that it just didn't click, even staring me right in the face. I'm actually an avid conservationist and hunter.

Back to my original posting.

So here is a completely different track.

Now this is completely my opinion, based on my own observations.

We have a major problem in North America, with the expansion and propagation of extremism. That includes, religious, environmental, political, hate/racism etc.

Are we at war with Islam or with the Muslim culture?
No, we are at war with Extremism, and groups like this are a symptom of not having laws in place to prevent these abuses.

As I posted earlier Canada has already put laws in place that prevent these acts. It came after lengthy debate regarding the freedom of expression, a fundamental part of Canada's constitution.

In Canada the decision was made that your rights are superseded by the fundamental rights of others.

Everyone has the right to live free of harassment and threat. That supersedes the freedom of expression rights.

Does anyone here think that a fundamental change to the interpretation of the US Constitution to allow for this would be a bad thing?

Delphic

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"Desre for good grammar makes one looking to destroy fun??"

I love it when the overly critical can't meet their own expectations.

Last edited by delphic; March 3rd, 2011 at 10:26 PM. Reason: Edit: To Clear the Air.
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