The Book of Venom

[Firemaster]

The Book of Venom
http://www.hasbro.com/common/images/heroscape/characters/master/B18D4F58-D56F-E112-465290D392665FB8.jpg
If you cannot see the Army Card graphic, check Hasbro's Unit Page (http://www.hasbro.com/games/kid-games/heroscape/default.cfm?page=Marvel/CharacterDetail&char_id=116&set_id=15&set_type=1) for stats and special powers, plus "character biography" and other non-game unit info.
_________________________________________________________________
-Rulings and Clarifications-
The 'S' symbol.
The 'S' symbol in the lower left-hand corner of the card signifies this figure has Superstrength. A figure with Superstrength is immune to Falling and Major Falling; the figure is not immune to Extreme Falling however. A figure with Superstrength is also able to ignore any abilities a destructible object has that would give it automatic shields. (Firemaster)

- WEB SPECIAL ATTACK : Using it on a figure with 0 defense
If I use Web Special Attack on a figure that has 0 defense dice, do they get any extra damage because they should be rolling –1 defense dice?
A figure cannot roll less than 0 defense dice. (Hasbro FAQ)
_________________________________________________________________
-Combinations and Synergies-

Synergy Benefits Received
Marvel:
TBA
Classic:
TBA

Synergy Benefits Offered
Marvel:
N/A
Classic:
N/A
_________________________________________________________________
-Strategy, Tactics and Tips-

- TBA




Unit Strategy Review
Unit Strategy Review: Venom (http://www.heroscapers.com/community/showthread.php?t=26013)

[dragonfire9788]

(My :2cents: may change when I get the figure)

Venom- See spider-man. A bit weaker. B+

[johnny139]

I've warmed up to Venom. Think of it this way - when Spidey avoids an attack, he swings away, out of range. When Venom avoids an attack, he laughs insanely and swings towards his aggressor, then proceding to beat the everloving snot out of him. Plus, his sculpt looks awesome. :D

[Dartheyegouger]

Each of the pairs of characters in Marvelscape are supposed to be Hero/Villain, but Venom's class is Vigilante. This representation of Venom was the Hero, not the Villain.


:2cents:

[jcb231]

Each of the pairs of characters in Marvelscape are supposed to be Hero/Villain, but Venom's class is Vigilante. This representation of Venom was the Hero, not the Villain.


:2cents:

Vigilantes don't have to be good guys. That term doesn't mean they are fighting for the right side. :-)

[GreyOwl]

Thought they don't have to be completely "good", vigilante does mean taking the law into one's own hands and fighting crime so it wouldn't apply to outright criminals. I think the version of Venom they were going for was the current one in the Thunderbolts, who is supposedly a "good" guy.

[Penitus]

Thought they don't have to be completely "good", vigilante does mean taking the law into one's own hands and fighting crime so it wouldn't apply to outright criminals. I think the version of Venom they were going for was the current one in the Thunderbolts, who is supposedly a "good" guy.

Nope. The sculpt is totally different. The Heroscape Venom is definitely Eddie Brock. Look at the box art. He's fighting Spider-Man.

[Argent]

Venom has been a vigilante for a long time. And even had his own book for awhile. But that did'nt stop him and Spider-man from clashing.

We'll find out if this is supposed to be the one in Thunderbolts or not when/if they release a bio. Since the one in Thunderbolts is Mac Gargan, the guy that used to be the Scorpion.

Personally, even if they do make him Gargan, which i doubt, he'll always be Eddie Brock to me in the game.

[Eclipse]

From the other thread on this:

Venom's always been a vigilante, even before lethal protector. It's just that 90% of the time, he thinks Peter Park is about the worst criminal in the city.

Also, this is definitely the Eddie Brock Venom. The Gargan Venom has visible eyes inside the while area and a significantly different looking chest design. The flat eyes and black costume spider pattern were only on the Eddie Brock version.

[jcb231]

Vigilantes may fight crime, but it doesn't have to be for good reasons....one criminal could pay a vigilante to kill other criminals and eliminate his competition. The term doesn't indicate he isn't a villain.

[AKflip]

Well the main thing about Venom in this set is that he doens't really like any of these heroes. Also (Eddie Brock) Venom isn't mentally stable. We've seen him flip flop on the side of good and evil several times. Each time its been for his own benefit. And since you can make the armies anyway you like, just come up with your own reason as to why Venom is doing what he is doing.

[AKflip]

Also I wish that they had a power that dealt with the symbiote. Also Venom negates Spidey's Spider sense. I just wish they gave Venom a different power to help seperate them a bit.

[rdhight]

Just because a character is evil, there's no obligation to represent that in the class box. Abomination is a Creature, Red Skull a Mastermind, Doom a Ruler, and Thanos a Conqueror. Except maybe for Conqueror, there are good superheroes who could use all of those descriptions accurately. none of them are really perjorative.

In Classic, Hawthorne's class is still Champion, and Isamu's class is still Ninja, despite the fact that they side with Utgar. The Vampires are a Lord, Lady, Devourer, and Duchess, and only a few of the worst creatures, like zombies and shades, are Devourers. Really, Devourer is about the only truly bad thing I can find for a class. The idea that an evil character needs an evil class seems way off base to me.

[Argent]

Also I wish that they had a power that dealt with the symbiote

They could have done alot of things, with alot of the heros they picked. But I think they had to draw the line somewhere, or they wouldn't have room left on the cards, and the points would be thru the roof.

That being said.... It would have been cool if Venom had something similar to the Viking Champions, where the symbiote went to another hero. I might have to do that as a scenario.... :ponder:

[Lotus]

Argent, check out my Symbiote Spiderman, it does just that, also around page 6 or so, there was a very nice discussion about a Symbiote Glyph.

[Eclipse]

Honestly though, the Symbiote attaching itself to a new host when Venom is defeated isn't really that common of an occurrence. it's happened a few times, but for the most part, when Venom goes down the Symbiote stays with Brock. Usually when it finds a new host its because it was forcibly removed from Brock and needs someone to help it find it's other half again.

[Lotus]

I think the Glyph and Scenario idea would be best for having the Symbiote move around a lot, you would not want to have Venom in such a game though, it wouldn't make much sense. But could be fun to have the Symbiote hop from character to character.

For Venom as a character I think the bond is too strong to have the Symbiote move much, unlike Spiderman who was too different from the Symbiote.

[Eclipse]

I think the Glyph and Scenario idea would be best for having the Symbiote move around a lot, you would not want to have Venom in such a game though, it wouldn't make much sense. But could be fun to have the Symbiote hop from character to character.

For Venom as a character I think the bond is too strong to have the Symbiote move much, unlike Spiderman who was too different from the Symbiote.

Spiderman's bond wasn't as strong not because they were too different really, he just didn't spend enough time with it. Besides, the Symbiote didn't leave Peter because they were defeated, Peter forcibly rejected it. Had he just been knocked out the Symbiote would have stayed put, probably even acted to protect him. I don't think there have been many situations where the Symbiotes have abandoned ship in general. They're really pretty loyal things overall.

[Lotus]

Hmm, that is true, but would be hard to play, it is much easier to play that it abandons when they are defeated.

[Argent]

I'd proably do something like the Hulk scenario in the rulebook but have it be venom, and unless he's "killed" by someone with a certain glyph, then the symbiote attaches intself to someone else (enemy unit) instead of dying. needs tweaking, but sounds cool in the initial thought.

[AKflip]

They could have done alot of things, with alot of the heros they picked. But I think they had to draw the line somewhere, or they wouldn't have room left on the cards, and the points would be thru the roof.

That being said.... It would have been cool if Venom had something similar to the Viking Champions, where the symbiote went to another hero. I might have to do that as a scenario.... :ponder:[/quote]

Oh don't get me wrong I understand that they don't want to overdue anything. But I just wished that they made Venom a little different than Spidey. Even if they just changed special web attack to read symbiote tendril special attack. I would have been happy. And I apologize for being so critical. I'm just a huge comic fan.

[thestaton]

If a squad such as the 4th Mass where to attack Venom / Spiderman, would you get to roll to leave the engagement for each figure that fires at you that got at least one skull?

[ChaosChild]

If a squad such as the 4th Mass where to attack Venom / Spiderman, would you get to roll to leave the engagement for each figure that fires at you that got at least one skull?

Venom/Spider-man does not need to be engaged to use Spider/Spidey Sense. Yes, they get to roll each time they are attacked and a skull is rolled. That goes for attacks from multiple squad figures or single figures that can attack multiple times.

[killercactus]

If a squad such as the 4th Mass where to attack Venom / Spiderman, would you get to roll to leave the engagement for each figure that fires at you that got at least one skull?

Venom/Spider-man does not need to be engaged to use Spider/Spidey Sense. Yes, they get to roll each time they are attacked and a skull is rolled. That goes for attacks from multiple squad figures or single figures that can attack multiple times.

"He who is Huge" is correct - Spiderman / Venom get to roll for Spider Sense everytime they're attacked and a skull is rolled. However, if either one of them is engaged when they begin to move away after successfully rolling for Spider Sense, their opponent will not get any leaving engagement rolls, because they may move using their Swing Line special power which ignores leaving engagement attacks.

[Mistman]

Erm... I have I question about Venom and Spidey. I was playing with venom and attacked him with a special attack. Can he use his spider sense against special attacks or can he not? I'm sorry if I should have started a new thread for this.

[Cavalier]

Erm... I have I question about Venom and Spidey. I was playing with venom and attacked him with a special attack. Can he use his spider sense against special attacks or can he not? I'm sorry if I should have started a new thread for this.

You asked this question in exactly the right place, that's what the Books are for.

http://www.hasbro.com/common/images/heroscape/characters/master/B18D4F58-D56F-E112-465290D392665FB8.jpg

There is no limitation on Spider Sense indicating that it cannot be used when being attacked with a Special Attack, therefore it is perfectly legal to use it when your opponent uses a Special Attack.

[Mistman]

Thanks. The only reason I was unsure about it is because special attacks are unaffected by modifiers, and I wasn't sure whether this counted.

[Cavalier]

Thanks. The only reason I was unsure about it is because special attacks are unaffected by modifiers, and I wasn't sure whether this counted.
Special Attacks receive no bonuses, but those defending against them do. :thumbsup:

[Simpsons Scaper]

I don't know about other peoples thoughts, but isn't Venom better statwise and cheaper than Spidey? Which would you rather, +2 Attack Dice , or +15% for Spidey Sense. I'm taking +2 attack dice. I think they should be the same points, or Venom should be more.

[CheddarLimbo]

I don't know about other peoples thoughts, but isn't Venom better statwise and cheaper than Spidey? Which would you rather, +2 Attack Dice , or +15% for Spidey Sense. I'm taking +2 attack dice. I think they should be the same points, or Venom should be more.

It's one of the things that makes the Heroscape system so versatile - the value of a figure's points can manifest in so many ways. It's not so simple to say that two figures with the same point cost should have the same stats. You as the player have to decide if you want to be more aggressive offensively, or if you'd prefer to have a better survivability.

[Sherman Davies]

Yeah, I thought that either Venom was undercosted or Spidey was overcosted when Marvelscape first came out, but I've found that that extra 15% chance for Spidey Sense is pretty useful. Is it enough to compensate Spidey for having two fewer attack dice? I dunno, but it's closer than I used to think. I now think Venom could be costed at 160 points (the same as Spidey) and still be worth playing.

Oh, and anyone ever notice how Spidey's power is called Spidey-Sense and Venom's is called Spider-Sense? Subtle but cool.

[Simpsons Scaper]

Oh, and anyone ever notice how Spidey's power is called Spidey-Sense and Venom's is called Spider-Sense? Subtle but cool.

Cool, I never noticed that!

[rommel1369]

Erm... I have I question about Venom and Spidey. I was playing with venom and attacked him with a special attack. Can he use his spider sense against special attacks or can he not? I'm sorry if I should have started a new thread for this.

You asked this question in exactly the right place, that's what the Books are for.

http://www.hasbro.com/common/images/heroscape/characters/master/B18D4F58-D56F-E112-465290D392665FB8.jpg

There is no limitation on Spider Sense indicating that it cannot be used when being attacked with a Special Attack, therefore it is perfectly legal to use it when your opponent uses a Special Attack.

Does Paralyzing Stare negate Spiderman/Venom's Spidey/Spider Sense? There was a debate over it last game we had. The way I read it is that if Spiderman is affected he still gets to roll the D20 for his skill but if he fails no defence dice. A few others in the group think ALL Spiderman's defences are negated when paralyzed... and in a way it kinda makes sense.... How could he slip away when paralyzed? Anyways just curious to see what everyone here thinks :smile:

[nyphot]

Does Paralyzing Stare negate Spiderman/Venom's Spidey/Spider Sense? There was a debate over it last game we had. The way I read it is that if Spiderman is affected he still gets to roll the D20 for his skill but if he fails no defence dice. A few others in the group think ALL Spiderman's defences are negated when paralyzed... and in a way it kinda makes sense.... How could he slip away when paralyzed? Anyways just curious to see what everyone here thinks :smile:

Hmm... can't find where this was discussed before, though I THINK it has been (for other units)... From what I recall, you're right (though it might not necessarily make "sense"). The d20 isn't a "defense die" and so gets to be rolled.

[arp12]

I answered (http://www.heroscapers.com/community/showthread.php?p=854043#post854043) in the Book of Me-Burq-Sa.

[killercactus]

Does Paralyzing Stare negate Spiderman/Venom's Spidey/Spider Sense? There was a debate over it last game we had. The way I read it is that if Spiderman is affected he still gets to roll the D20 for his skill but if he fails no defence dice. A few others in the group think ALL Spiderman's defences are negated when paralyzed... and in a way it kinda makes sense.... How could he slip away when paralyzed? Anyways just curious to see what everyone here thinks :smile:

Hmm... can't find where this was discussed before, though I THINK it has been (for other units)... From what I recall, you're right (though it might not necessarily make "sense"). The d20 isn't a "defense die" and so gets to be rolled.

That's correct. "Defense dice" refer only to the combat dice rolled for defense that you use to count shields. Spider-Sense is a Special Power - it actually has nothing to do with Defense dice, so it is not affected by Paralyzing Stare (or any other ability that affects Defense dice, like Whip 12).

[rommel1369]

Also one more question that has come up due to spider sense. If the Retchets of Bogdan roll all skulls against Venom is he destroyed immediately or does he get a crack at spider sense? From looking at the card I'd say yes he gets to roll the D-20 but if he fails he is toast. My friend just got the Retchets and I like to use Venom so I can picture another debate in the future... why not snub it out beforehand? The best way is advice from fellow heroscapers... so all can see ;)

[Sherman Davies]

The situation is the same as when the Rechets attack Isamu or any other figure with Vanish or Disappearing Ninja, since those powers are what Spider-Sense duplicates. The answer is that Spider-Man and Venom do not get to roll for their Spider-Sense ability if the Rechets' Lethal Sting activates. This makes the Rechets just about the ideal counterdrafts to any high-priced, small or medium heroes like superheroes.

Here's the post from The Guru that originally resolved this question. (http://www.heroscapers.com/community/showthread.php?p=528353#post528353)

[Taeblewalker]

I am writing the Venom Strategy guide now, and I am going to assume that Spider/Spidey sense do not activate, as per the Ninjas.

[IAmBatman]

No assuming necessary. That link from Sherman Davies provided an official answer. Spider-Sense works exactly the same way as Disappearing Ninja when it comes to situations like this. :-)

[rommel1369]

Cool sweet deal thanks a bunch :D

[Trav11111]

Now with the release of web of spider-man couldn't carnage and anti-venom cards be made using venom (or spider-man) as a base. I was wondering because I just got an Anti-Venom in a pack I bought.

[Taeblewalker]

Carnage would probably just have a higher attack, and maybe more life. The utter simplicity (on some levels) of HS; namely, the lack of energy keyword for attacks (sonic, fire, etc.), means that one cannot duplicate the weakness of Venom and Carnage vs. Sonic attacks, or Superman vs. Magic.

[Griffin]

Carnage would probably just have a higher attack, and maybe more life. The utter simplicity (on some levels) of HS; namely, the lack of energy keyword for attacks (sonic, fire, etc.), means that one cannot duplicate the weakness of Venom and Carnage vs. Sonic attacks, or Superman vs. Magic.
I don't know, I think Black Canary's Canary Cry exploits Symbiotes pretty nicely. ;)

[Cavalier]

Now with the release of web of spider-man couldn't carnage and anti-venom cards be made using venom (or spider-man) as a base. I was wondering because I just got an Anti-Venom in a pack I bought.
Does this really belong in the Book of Venom? This should be in the customs section.

[IAmBatman]

Now with the release of web of spider-man couldn't carnage and anti-venom cards be made using venom (or spider-man) as a base. I was wondering because I just got an Anti-Venom in a pack I bought.
Does this really belong in the Book of Venom? This should be in the customs section.

Maybe, but with the official game essentially dead in the water, you can't really blame people for trying to keep it relevant to them.

[samuelfrost4]

Also I wish that they had a power that dealt with the symbiote. Also Venom negates Spidey's Spider sense. I just wish they gave Venom a different power to help seperate them a bit.

I totally agree. They are almost exactly the same. :P

[The Deadliest Warrior]

Also I wish that they had a power that dealt with the symbiote. Also Venom negates Spidey's Spider sense. I just wish they gave Venom a different power to help seperate them a bit.

I totally agree. They are almost exactly the same. :P
Actually, I like Venom better because while Spider-Man only has to roll an 11 compared to Venom's 14, Venom has a greater offensive capability with a much higher life and attack. Spider-Man is an obnoxious attack dodger. Venom is a gameplay predator.

[IAmBatman]

Much higher attack, yes. But their life is the same.

[Scapemage]

I also prefer Venom. He's cheaper as well.

[The Deadliest Warrior]

Much higher attack, yes. But their life is the same.

[The Deadliest Warrior]

Sorry, I don't know why that didn't post any words. ^^
Anyway, I could've sworn Venom had 6 Life! D'oh!

[IAmBatman]

Sometimes there are no words. :-P

[Gardevoir]

To be honest, i cant see him really fitting into marvelscape, but i can for normal heroscape. in normal heroscape he is still risky though, in some games he fails for spider sense and bites the dust so quick. in others though he just obliderates all. i find it difficult to get his points back with him, but he is a great castle door smasher, even with Q9 around.

[Scapemage]

To be honest, i cant see him really fitting into marvelscape, but i can for normal heroscape. in normal heroscape he is still risky though, in some games he fails for spider sense and bites the dust so quick. in others though he just obliderates all. i find it difficult to get his points back with him, but he is a great castle door smasher, even with Q9 around.
Why wouldn't he fit into Marvelscape? He's very cheap for 6 attack, which does compete in Marvelscape. His defense may seem shabby, but Spider-Sense keeps him in check. I find that getting his points back isn't too hard as long as you get him into the fight. Sitting back doing nothing makes his attack basically 0.

[Gardevoir]

To be honest, i cant see him really fitting into marvelscape, but i can for normal heroscape. in normal heroscape he is still risky though, in some games he fails for spider sense and bites the dust so quick. in others though he just obliderates all. i find it difficult to get his points back with him, but he is a great castle door smasher, even with Q9 around.
Why wouldn't he fit into Marvelscape? He's very cheap for 6 attack, which does compete in Marvelscape. His defense may seem shabby, but Spider-Sense keeps him in check. I find that getting his points back isn't too hard as long as you get him into the fight. Sitting back doing nothing makes his attack basically 0.

I find that when i use venom in marvelscape, yer sure his attack is on par with a lot of other strong marvel characters but his spider-sense doesnt work very often in games and he dies quite quickly (this could be just unlucky rolls however), even if he is quite cheap compared to the others. i just think he works better in normal heroscape. he can do well in marvelscape now and then, but he never seems to last long with me.

[Tornado]

Part of the problem is that Venom is the cheapest figure in Marvel. So of course it is going to be hard to get your points worth when every single figure is of a higher cost and for the most part, more powerful. It really is not surprising that he falls quickly when there are figures twice his points.

Marvel only has 10 figures with drastically different points so it is hard for some figures to shine. You really need a larger pool to test against to determine proper point value. This is most likely why Venom fairs so much better for you when mixed in with classic.
If you want to see Venom up against similar pointed supers and even much lower pointed super heroes I highly recommend that you check out C3G.
A whole new universe of fun awaits... peace

[SirGalahad]

I highly recommend that you check out C3G.
A whole new universe of fun awaits

:word:

[Griffin]

Venom gets plenty of use in my games, because of what Tornado said. I play all the Hasbro Marvel stuff mixed in with C3G and it works great. Heck, C3G was designed to work with the Hasbro Marvel Set. It is a lot of fun having a big Marvel and DC universe to build armies with. :D

[Scapemage]

Venom gets plenty of use in my games, because of what Tornado said. I play all the Hasbro Marvel stuff mixed in with C3G and it works great. Heck, C3G was designed to work with the Hasbro Marvel Set. It is a lot of fun having a big Marvel and DC universe to build armies with. :D
I actually haven't mixed yet. Hm... I shall!

[Griffin]

Venom gets plenty of use in my games, because of what Tornado said. I play all the Hasbro Marvel stuff mixed in with C3G and it works great. Heck, C3G was designed to work with the Hasbro Marvel Set. It is a lot of fun having a big Marvel and DC universe to build armies with. :D
I actually haven't mixed yet. Hm... I shall!
What? You mean you have never mixed Hasbro Marvel with C3G? :shock:

[Scapemage]

Venom gets plenty of use in my games, because of what Tornado said. I play all the Hasbro Marvel stuff mixed in with C3G and it works great. Heck, C3G was designed to work with the Hasbro Marvel Set. It is a lot of fun having a big Marvel and DC universe to build armies with. :D
I actually haven't mixed yet. Hm... I shall!
What? You mean you have never mixed Hasbro Marvel with C3G? :shock:
Not really. I used Venom once or twice in Vigilantes before all the Vigilantes came out (pre-Wave 4), and maybe Captain America once or twice, but that's it. Now that I take a look, 7/10 Marvel heroes currently have synergy.