Clarification on Shades! (Too good to be true or accurate?)

[dnutt99]

Soul Devour
Before moving, each Shade of Bleakewood you control may choose an adjacent uniques hero. Roll the d20 once for each Shade. If you roll a 19 or 20, destroy the Shade of Bleakewood figure, then take control of the chosen unique hero and remove any Order Markers on its card. You now control that army card.

Assume I have 2 suqads of Shades, (6 total), and 4 of them are engaged with a unique hero.

:?: I get to roll the d20 for the 4 engaged Shades and THEN take a turn with any 3.
OR
:?: Regardless of how many Shades are adjacent to unique heroes I must choose only 3 Shades to activate. Period.

:ponder: While I'm at it,...

:?: If 3 Shades are adjacent to, let's say Q9, ( :twisted: ) do I have 3 potential rolls for Devour, or is it similar to Marrden Hounds where you can only roll once regardless of the number of Hounds are adjacent?

I'm trying to learn them before I actually get them!

EDIT: This is easier to understand.
- 5 of 9 Shades, (still in play), are engaged with enemy unique heroes.
- 5 Shades get to roll for Devour.
- 2 Shades are adjacent to Q9 : I get to roll for Devour a second time if the first attempt fails.
- I succeed Devour with 2 Shades.
- I can now move/attack with ANY 3 of the 7 Shades remaining on the board.

CORRECT :?:

[thehandofzarquon]

It's each shade you control and they all get their own chance.

[Aldin]

DNutt - the only ones who get to try the power are the ones who would be moving. So only three per turn.

~Aldin

EDIT Upon re-reading the text I've changed my mind - it looks like they work like the Marrdens /EDIT

[dnutt99]

It's each shade you control and they all get their own chance.

DNutt - the only ones who get to try the power are the ones who would be moving. So only three per turn.

~Aldin

EDIT Upon re-reading the text I've changed my mind - it looks like they work like the Marrdens /EDIT

Looks like we need some assistance finalizing this one! :? I've got,...
1 for All shades and
1 for 3 Shades

1 for each Shade gets a chance and
1 for "Marrden-like"

Where's the lawyers :?:

[Hex_Enduction_Hour]

Yeah all of them get a chance to devour some souls. Now that is sweet. I hadn't noticed that little detail, Dnutt!

[Josef]

All the can get to use the Devour thing. The role doesn't work like the Hounds, role for each shade.

Thats my ruling.

[johnny139]

All the can get to use the Devour thing. The role doesn't work like the Hounds, role for each shade.

Thats my ruling.

Secon'.

[Aldin]

Where's the lawyers :?:

The bad news is... I think I am one. The good news is... I really am pretty sure that all your Shades adjacent to enemy unique heroes get a shot. The bad news is... I doubt that you'll get to take a shot with more than three on any given turn, ever. The good news is... if you succeed you still get to move three other Shades.

~Aldin

[thehandofzarquon]

Where's the lawyers :?:

All shades you control get to soul devour and they each get their own roll because it says (bolded):

Soul Devour
Before moving, each Shade of Bleakewood you control may choose an adjacent uniques hero. Roll the d20 once for each Shade. If you roll a 19 or 20, destroy the Shade of Bleakewood figure, then take control of the chosen unique hero and remove any Order Markers on its card. You now control that army card.

Each shade you control chooses an adjacent hero then you roll the die for each of these shades. You are rolling for each shade, rather than each figure adjacent to the shades. (Unlike the Marrdens, where you roll for each figure adjacent to the marrdens, not each marrden.)

Another (debatable, I suppose) point is you have to assign targets for your Shades before you roll for any of them, so you could end up wasting Shade rolls in some cases.

[jcb231]

I think the card means that you roll for every shade figure you control once, but each individual shade only gets to pick one adjacent hero to attempt a devour.

[dnutt99]

The bad news is... I think I am one. The good news is... I really am pretty sure that all your Shades adjacent to enemy unique heroes get a shot. The bad news is... I doubt that you'll get to take a shot with more than three on any given turn, ever. The good news is... if you succeed you still get to move three other Shades.

~Aldin

OK,... too much news at one time! To clarify:

- 5 of 9 Shades, (still in play), are engaged with enemy unique heroes.
- 5 Shades get to roll for Devour.
- 2 Shades are adjacent to Q9 : I get to roll for Devour a second time if the first attempt fails.
- I succeed Devour with 2 Shades.
- I can now move/attack with ANY 3 of the 7 Shades remaining on the board.

CORRECT :?:

[Aldin]

Nuts! I see where I caused confusion about the Marrdens. I did not mean to imply that you would only get one roll against each hero, only that (like the Marrdens) every figure, activated or not, was available for using the power.

~Aldin

[Aldin]

OK,... too much news at one time! To clarify:

- 5 of 9 Shades, (still in play), are engaged with enemy unique heroes.
- 5 Shades get to roll for Devour.
- 2 Shades are adjacent to Q9 : I get to roll for Devour a second time if the first attempt fails.
- I succeed Devour with 2 Shades.
- I can now move/attack with ANY 3 of the 7 Shades remaining on the board.

CORRECT :?:

That's my understanding exactly.

~Aldin

[Hex_Enduction_Hour]

Fun stuff! It follows exactly what the cards says too.
:wink:

[dnutt99]

Fun stuff! It follows exactly what the cards says too.
:wink:

:pray: We just pray it's correct :pray:

[dnutt99]

IS THIS OFFICIAL?

[Hex_Enduction_Hour]

IS THIS OFFICIAL?
It's not official, but I think it darned well should be.

[netherspirit]

I am going to say that you would get to roll for all your shades that are adjacent to a unique hero.

[ZODGILLA!]

I thought order markers determined which units are "activated" during a turn, and the number of figures on the card was the limiting factor. Are the Shades setting a precedent or are there other units that have already set this precedent?

[netherspirit]

I thought order markers determined which units are "activated" during a turn, and the number of figures on the card was the limiting factor. Are the Shades setting a precedent or are there other units that have already set this precedent?

The turn consists of three main "phases."
1. Reveal your Order Marker
2. Move any or all the figures on the card (this is the when you choose which figures are "activated" for the turn).
3. Attack with the figures that moved.

The reason I think you get to roll for all them (besides the actual wording on the card) is because the power activates before moving, which is before you choose the figures that are activated for the for the turn.

[AgentX-127]

When I first saw this power, I thought,
"This is unbelievable! 3 seperate 10% chance of shackling and they're commons?"

The very idea that all the shades on the board would get to roll,
and then you get to take a full turn with 3 of them,
chills me to the bone!

I think they are going to change the game.

(Yeah, I know, everything they release changes the game to some extent. I said that for the sake of drama.)

Oh yeah! I got to get me lots of 'em!

[Eclipse]

When I first saw this power, I thought,
"This is unbelievable! 3 seperate 10% chance of shackling and they're commons?"

The very idea that all the shades on the board would get to roll,
and then you get to take a full turn with 3 of them,
chills me to the bone!

I think they are going to change the game.

(Yeah, I know, everything they release changes the game to some extent. I said that for the sake of drama.)

Oh yeah! I got to get me lots of 'em!

How will they change the game? They only affect Unique Heroes, which are currently almost useless. They'll make them... completely useless?

[Hex_Enduction_Hour]

When I first saw this power, I thought,
"This is unbelievable! 3 seperate 10% chance of shackling and they're commons?"

The very idea that all the shades on the board would get to roll,
and then you get to take a full turn with 3 of them,
chills me to the bone!

I think they are going to change the game.

(Yeah, I know, everything they release changes the game to some extent. I said that for the sake of drama.)

Oh yeah! I got to get me lots of 'em!

How will they change the game? They only affect Unique Heroes, which are currently almost useless. They'll make them... completely useless?

Also, getting the shades into position and surviving a turn are conditions set up to lessen the potency of their ability. But it's going to be great to read the thread that contains the most Soul Devours in one turn!
:twisted:

[AgentX-127]

How will they change the game? They only affect Unique Heroes, which are currently almost useless. They'll make them... completely useless?I know, that's what makes me :cry:
'cause I'm a Hero Lover...

I've been relying on heavies such as Q9, Nilfheim, Jotun and Braxas, and these things are going to be quite a concern for me now.

So if my opponent starts drafting Shades, what should I grab to counter them?

[Homba]

I agree that the Shades play exactly the way the card says they play. Also a nice point by thehandofzarquon that you have to declare each shade's target prior to rolling (exactly as the card instructs), so you may waste some attempts in certain configurations -- though the loss won't seem great because it means you succeeded with an attempt.

The Marden Hounds are a precedent ONLY IN THE SENSE that marden hounds you didn't "activate" STILL get to make their plague roll if adjacent to an enemy (though, per the card, you only get one roll per enemy no matter how many adjacent Hounds). In the sense that a large number of engaged hounds could roll the d20 -- though only 3 hounds are actually activated -- the Shades are similar.

The trick with the Shades is to get in enough attempts to raise your odds sufficiently to devour the soul of one or more victims. It is hard to roll a 19-20. But with more attempts, it becomes more likely. With the +1 d20 glyph, watch out...

H

[Neurosion]

I saw the shades in action yesterday for the first time. The guy with the shades managed to engage Nilfheim with the last turn of round one and then won engagement in round two, so he had a free shot at the dragon. Ultimately he got three, five, and four chances to devour Nilfheim but he whiffed every roll. Height and the attack glyph made it a moot point, though.

One of the things that makes them dangerous is that they're so fast! Theracus is the only flier that can match them.

Overall it was a slaughter, but the other guy drafted badly. He had Jotun, Nilfheim, and Kelda against fifteen zombies and six shades. Someone didn't study up on Wave 6 before coming to the war.

[Bixby]

Wow. Just found this thread, My wave six stuff just arrived and I have not played with the units yet. I have 6 squads of these guys. I should field 5 of them on one of our 500 point games just for chuckles and grins. Could be fun times :)

[toddrew]

Wow. Just found this thread, My wave six stuff just arrived and I have not played with the units yet. I have 6 squads of these guys. I should field 5 of them on one of our 500 point games just for chuckles and grins. Could be fun times :)

Better hope your opponent has some unique heroes in their army :lol:

[Bixby]

And that one of them is not Dund. :)

[Hex_Enduction_Hour]

I saw the shades in action yesterday for the first time. The guy with the shades managed to engage Nilfheim with the last turn of round one and then won engagement in round two, so he had a free shot at the dragon.
I played last night and this strategy was brought up. Get the Shades engaged with heroes at the end of the round and then attempt to get that initiative for some Soul Devour attempts.
Guerillanator also suggested protecting a target with Shades. Allow the opponent's figures (hopefully unique heroes) to have to engage the Shades and then on your turn attempt to Devour. It's situational at best, but I do like that idea.

Btw, The Shades devoured my Raelin's soul. Tis sad. I spent my next few rounds trying to destroy Raelin with my Imperium as the zombies shuffled closer...and closer...and closer...and closer...

[toddrew]

And that one of them is not Dund. :)

Actually, as another testament to his suckiness, since he has to stare before moving (which I think was given to him in order to protect him when he whiffs on the gaze), one can nimbly stealth fly around until attempting to possess him. Still would have to favor Dund in that situation, though there would be upset stomachs all around waiting for the d20 to render judgement :)

[dnutt99]

IT'S OFFICIAL!
- 5 of 9 Shades, (still in play), are engaged with enemy unique heroes.
- 5 Shades get to roll for Devour.
- 2 Shades are adjacent to Q9 : I get to roll for Devour a second time if the first attempt fails.
- I succeed Devour with 2 Shades.
- I can now move/attack with ANY 3 of the 7 Shades remaining on the board.

IS THIS CORRECT?

FROM WIZARDS OF THE COAST CUS. SVC. DEPT.
Shades of Bleakewood and their Proper Use During Gameplay [Incident: 061220-000203]

Yes indeed. Looks like you have it right!

Good Luck and Game On!

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[Rÿchean]

Wizard's of the Coast is giving official responses to Heroscape questions now?

I know there was speculation they were go gin to pick up the marketing distro of product at some point; didn't realize we were at that point and didn't realize they would be answering game play questions...hmmmm
:shrug:

[netherspirit]

Wizard's of the Coast is giving official responses to Heroscape questions now?

Someone hasn't been our homepage lately. :D

[Rÿchean]

yeah i guess in the last 24 hours :-P

[gamjuven]

this is why i love the shades! cause of their mind shackle on crack ability!. i just need to playtest them with a zombie horde for good fun! I thought their ability was pretty straight forward, i was wondering why people weren't talking about them more often, cause they seem pretty sweet to me.

[dnutt99]

this is why i love the shades! cause of their mind shackle on crack ability!. i just need to playtest them with a zombie horde for good fun! I thought their ability was pretty straight forward, i was wondering why people weren't talking about them more often, cause they seem pretty sweet to me.

Yeah! I'm trying to get in the habit of "analyzing" the cards before I actually get the units or play with them so that I get used to playing them properly. I was also shocked that no one's really had much to say about them as well. They're going to be so much fun when they're fielded in good quantities! :D

[Aldin]

Yeah! I'm trying to get in the habit of "analyzing" the cards before I actually get the units or play with them so that I get used to playing them properly. I was also shocked that no one's really had much to say about them as well. They're going to be so much fun when they're fielded in good quantities! :D

DNutt,

Next time we get together you're gonna have to school me with Shades :wink:

~Aldin

[dnutt99]

DNutt,

Next time we get together you're gonna have to school me with Shades :wink:

~Aldin

It'd be my priviledge, ....
Now all I have to do is get some! Then, ... GET SOME MORE!!!
:D

*PS- You and I are overdue for a match good sir!

[Aldin]

*Aldin casts ressurect dead*

Hey gang, do we need to revisit this question in light of the recent fun we've been having with WotC? I saw Staelth Dodge's comment here and was going to link this thread in response that you roll for all Shades when I noticed it's an early WotC ruling. Not sure where we as a community stand on this one at this point.

~Aldin, taking control

[Rÿchean]

Hey gang, do we need to revisit this question in light of the recent fun we've been having with WotC? NO

[netherspirit]

Hey gang, do we need to revisit this question in light of the recent fun we've been having with WotC? NO

DITTO

They got this one right.

[Homba]

They got this one right.

Agreed.

[dnutt99]

It's Perfect as it stands! :D

[Aldin]

Yay! Consensus!

~Aldin, group-hugging

[Revdyer]

If I'd been here sooner, I'd have agreeded heroically...as it is, I just agree lamely and late.

[Xotli]

BTW, just thought I'd throw this out there ...

SSX and I are in the midst of one of those 1000-2000 pt battles (which are the only kind he likes anyways ... I think he prefers drafting to actually playing sometimes ... but I digress) and he picked 3 Shades (i.e. 1 squad) for his army. He was supposed to be defending his castle, but (figuring the best defense is a good offense, I spose) he immediately sent the Shades across the board to my side.

Now, of course, I wasn't about to let any unique heroes near them. So there were absolutely no souls devoured. But they still took out a full squad of VV's and most of a squad of monks before I could take them down, and they had no backup for most of that time (although he did bring up Runa towards the end there). So I think the moral is that the Shades can still be effective even without the flashy soul devouring bit.

[TyrionXavier]

BTW, just thought I'd throw this out there ...

SSX and I are in the midst of one of those 1000-2000 pt battles (which are the only kind he likes anyways ... I think he prefers drafting to actually playing sometimes ... but I digress) and he picked 3 Shades (i.e. 1 squad) for his army. He was supposed to be defending his castle, but (figuring the best defense is a good offense, I spose) he immediately sent the Shades across the board to my side.

Now, of course, I wasn't about to let any unique heroes near them. So there were absolutely no souls devoured. But they still took out a full squad of VV's and most of a squad of monks before I could take them down, and they had no backup for most of that time (although he did bring up Runa towards the end there). So I think the moral is that the Shades can still be effective even without the flashy soul devouring bit.

Was playing a 3 player game about 2 weeks ago. I had the fabulous opportunity to go last. The first 2 turns go by and nothing spectacular happens. First 2 turns, we all advance some heroes. 1P Braxus advances and takes out 3 guys 2P's army, and he's out of turn markers. 2P goes and uses deadeye dan, and takes one out 1P's KMAs. I go on my turn 2 and advance 3 shades, right next to Braxus.

Turn 3 goes, and 1P has nothing near Braxus to pick off my shades, so he's panicked. 2P goes and just advances some more melee, nothing happens. I go... whiff, whiff, whiff. Didn't get him.

Then I attack with height on all 3. 3 skulls, 2 skulls, 3 skulls. Dead Braxus.

From that game forward, whenever I play shades, they (both of them) gun for them. They're as good as dead.

[bluekitsune13]

From that game forward, whenever I play shades, they (both of them) gun for them. They're as good as dead.

But they're already dead, aren't they? :lol: