Deathreavers...help me see the value.

[jcb231]

I'm having trouble seeing the point of the Deathreavers....I thought I'd love them when I first got them but the more I play them the worse it gets. I thought they'd be good swarmers but they're not.

So far the only solid use I can see for them is to hold glyphs without spending order markers.

Other than that, why should I draft them over Blade Gruts or Venoc Vipers or Arrow Gruts or Theracus?

Four attacks of one die each....Arrow Gruts only roll 1 die, but at least it's from range so they have a better shot of getting into high ground. Plus both varieties of Grut bond with multiple targets. Arrow Gruts in particular have some great bonding....they can move Swogs into position to boost their attacks, then move Krug and/or Mimring about to rough up the enemy.

Venocs can rush ahead and are an excellent first-strike weapon.

Theracus can carry your snipers to high positions or rush to an objective.

Why should I draft the rats? They're fun as all heck and cool to play around with, but are they worth drafting? Maybe if instead of scatter you could move and attack with one after being attacked.....

[reapersaurus]

Well, I'm sure you realize the problem you're having :

You don;t draft the rats because of their 1 attack. :lol:

You draft the rats to take advantage of their unprecedented movement.

[MBSowards]

A forty point squad that can swarm enemy ranged units to tie them up when they get shot at so you can bring in the big guns and clean them up? I'd prefer they didn't have any attack at all.

[Thor]

Yup, these guys are not meant to kill opponents (though against a squad of Venoc Vipers they do win 73% of the time anyways), they are meant to tie up range figures.

Your opponent drafts a 70 point squad of Minute Men, you draft a 40 point squad of Deathreavers. Every shot your opponent takes at the rats moves them that much closer to the Minute Men until they are finally engaged and the MM have no other option besides shooting the rats or risking a disengagement attack. With 4 defense they should hold the MM up pretty good and who knows, they might kill one or two while getting into position. It's at this point you bring in the higher damaging melee squad or hero and bring the pain to those pesky MM. You can move in with much greater ease and cause some destruction now that you arn't getting pelted by 4 figures from range. The Deathreavers are GREAT!

[Jormi_Boced]

Yep, they are total harrassment units

[LilNewbie]

Yep, they are total harrassment units

Just like younger siblings or distant relatives. :D

Newb.

[Joah]

Yep, they are total harrassment units

Just like younger siblings or distant relatives. :D

Newb. :lol:

Too funny lilnewbie.

I've only got to play them a couple of times.

The first time, I was playing against someone who had never seen them before. He quickly understood.

The second time, I put up two squads of them.
The guy I was playing started sweating a bit. :wink:

[Riggler]

I agree with what was said above. These things are nasty. I've played three games with them. And I've playtested them solo in three others.

In five of six of the above they did fairly well. Even when they didn't really up on something to engage it and even when faced with counter-drafted ranged special attack units, they served their purpose of distracting the enemy for long enough to get heavy melee hitters close enough or get their allied range units in a perfect position for attack.


The game in which they didn't do well is when just one squad was being played and it got nailed with two grenades before they got to go.

[jcb231]

D'oh!!!!

Can't believe I wasn't looking at them that way. And I'm a big harrassment player too!

I usually use Blade Gruts for harrassment, but these guys work better, obviously. Darn my rotten brain.

[Rÿchean]

they are the new pawns of heroscape....get several sets, tie stuff up...control choke points, take the high ground...dictate when and where you opponent attacks...you back them up with good ranged forces...it can and does work well

[Hex_Enduction_Hour]

JCB, the Reavers are great to direct the opponent's ranged units to where YOU want them to fire! Take a whole slew of rats and engage any range units (preferably those with normal attacks). The opposition can fire at the rats - kill one or not, two more can move in and torture them or another ranged unit!

On the following round, leave the rats alone and advance any rear guard that need to move up. If your opponent wants to take on the rats, that's okay, he'll be helping you move a couple without you placing any turn markers on their card. 8)

I love the Reavers. They add a whole new angle on the game play.

they are the new pawns of heroscape....get several sets, tie stuff up...control choke points, take the high ground...dictate when and where you opponent attacks...you back them up with good ranged forces...it can and does work well

Yeah. There ya go.
:toast:

[toddrew]

Also work well as a melee sheild for fragile when confronted ranged units like the Nakita Agents or KM (like they need any help :) )

[Hahma]

JCB, the Reavers are great to direct the opponent's ranged units to where YOU want them to fire! Take a whole slew of rats and engage any range units (preferably those with normal attacks). The opposition can fire at the rats - kill one or not, two more can move in and torture them or another ranged unit!

On the following round, leave the rats alone and advance any rear guard that need to move up. If your opponent wants to take on the rats, that's okay, he'll be helping you move a couple without you placing any turn markers on their card. 8)

I love the Reavers. They add a whole new angle on the game play.

they are the new pawns of heroscape....get several sets, tie stuff up...control choke points, take the high ground...dictate when and where you opponent attacks...you back them up with good ranged forces...it can and does work well

Yeah. There ya go.
:toast:



I love them, they're cheap and very effective at tying up enemy ranged units. Great for keeping fire off your main forces as they close in.

[Su_Nan]

Not to mention they are good at climbing to a degree. Kinda like pseudo flying. Also they can jump downward on an unsuspecting oppent who would otherwise think they would take falling damage and ignore the falling damage and then bam.

[jbbnbsmith]

I didn't see anyone else mention this, so I will. They also work great with the blastatrons. Swarm them in, attack (sometimes you get lucky!), then boost your blastatrons' attack +1 for each reaver.

[LilNewbie]

Blastatrons only receive the bonus from Vydar Soulborgs.

Newb.

[toddrew]

I said on another thread that reavers should be Vydar :twisted: , but blastatrons would need to be about 150 points :lol:

[jbbnbsmith]

Blastatrons only receive the bonus from Vydar Soulborgs.

Newb.
In the immortal words of Emily Latella (you know, the Gilda Radner character) "...oh...that's different....never mind"

[toddrew]

In the immortal words of Emily Latella (you know, the Gilda Radner character) "...oh...that's different....never mind"

Great reference :lol: Exactly who pops into my mind when my reality is adjusted :)

[LilNewbie]

Blastatrons only receive the bonus from Vydar Soulborgs.

Newb.
In the immortal words of Emily Latella (you know, the Gilda Radner character) "...oh...that's different....never mind"

LOL!

"What's this about no violins on TV? "
"Ma'am, that's no violence on TV."
"...oh...that's different....never mind."

Great stuff! Thanks for the laugh.

Newb.

[AmishBurrito]

Not to mention they are good at climbing to a degree. Kinda like pseudo flying. Also they can jump downward on an unsuspecting oppent who would otherwise think they would take falling damage and ignore the falling damage and then bam.

Climbing X2 only doubles their height, it doesnt help their move at all when climbing. It just makes it so they are normal when going to climb as opposed to giving them a disadvantage since they are small.

[Thor]

Not to mention they are good at climbing to a degree. Kinda like pseudo flying. Also they can jump downward on an unsuspecting oppent who would otherwise think they would take falling damage and ignore the falling damage and then bam.

Climbing X2 only doubles their height, it doesnt help their move at all when climbing. It just makes it so they are normal when going to climb as opposed to giving them a disadvantage since they are small.
Part of me thinks the Deathreavers should almost not have the double climbing. I mean that would be about the only thing to slow this insanely fast moving squad down. Get your range figures some height and make those pesky rats work to get to you.

Also I sort of question their disengage. I mean you can't even tie them up as they are advancing, they can just pass by any enemy figure they want and keep moving towards their goal. I dunno about these guys. Since they have both of these abilities they are like the perfect counter to just about any range unit. I am still trying to figure out if that is a good or bad thing :wink:

[Sweetcurse]

How about fun value? That counts too. LIttle rats running around are always fun.

[ScoringRubric]

i just love saying "hang on, i get to move some of these!"

[Avenger]

just bought my second pack of them.

[DoesntCompute]

The rats have entered my top 3 favorite units.
1) Speed. Their normal movement is 6. Combined with the rat frenzy tactic and using a road for your normal movement you can move 2 rats 25 spaces, 4 rats 13 spaces, or 4 rats 9 and 4 other rats 4 etc. In close quarters, the rats will often be able to claim the high ground because of their speed and disengage.

2) Durability. The 4 defense is nice but if a melee squad attacks them, you can move other rats out of danger when the first rat is attacked.

3) Offense. Well not the rats themselves. They are one of those support units that doesn't need to kill their point total to be effective. They can set up opponents figures to be sitting ducks for your ranged units. With disengage, they have their choice of who they want to tie up.

4) Protection. People have mentioned tying up opponents ranged units but they are awesome at tying up melee squads. How often does the opponenet risk a disengage attack with a squad figure? Not often because a 50% chance of death is not worth it. Therefore the melee squad will have to attack the rats and leave your ranged figures alone.

5) Cost. 40 points! Are you kidding me? For 80 points, you can get 8 of these guys. To be able to mess with your opponents and make them fight on your terms for 80 points is awesome.

I find the rats to be one of the most flexible units out there. They can capture glyphs, tie up ranged units, engage melee squads, and even kill a random unit once in a while. I had 3 squads of these guys last night against 2 opponents and was able to completely disrupt both of their plans at the same time with the rats.

[jcb231]

If you want to move lots of rats, draft a crapload of them and then use shaolin assaults to attack 6 or more with each monk....you could easily be scattering 36 rats across the board, or two rats 18 times...more if you have an improbably built map that allows more than 6 rats to be adjacent to a monk.

[Hex_Enduction_Hour]

i just love saying "hang on, i get to move some of these!"
:toast:

[DoesntCompute]

If you want to move lots of rats, draft a crapload of them and then use shaolin assaults to attack 6 or more with each monk....you could easily be scattering 36 rats across the board, or two rats 18 times...more if you have an improbably built map that allows more than 6 rats to be adjacent to a monk.

Me:
:shock: :? :) :D 8) :neener:

Opponent:
:shock: :? :x :blowup: :evil: :johnwoo:

[AmishBurrito]

If you want to move lots of rats, draft a crapload of them and then use shaolin assaults to attack 6 or more with each monk....you could easily be scattering 36 rats across the board, or two rats 18 times...more if you have an improbably built map that allows more than 6 rats to be adjacent to a monk.

but why would you want to kill yourself?
3 attack vs 4 D doesnt sound good to me.

[aielman]

yah but with glyphs....


how long would it take to get a glyph or two??? then you could feasibly have 6 d or more depending on hieght.

[dnutt99]

Climbing X2 only doubles their height, it doesnt help their move at all when climbing. It just makes it so they are normal when going to climb as opposed to giving them a disadvantage since they are small.

:?: 1) For the Deathreavers, (those dirty rats), I understand the 'ClimbX2' help for coming down, (they can climb down from a height of 5 without rolling for damage), . . . . but how does it help AT ALL for climbing up. They already have a move of 6, ... I mean does it help in any way?

By rule, (2nd edition) a figure can not move up a number of levels equal to or higher than its own height, so without climbx2 a rat could only move 2 levels higher. I trust you are counting each level in the move.

I thought the same thing :!: :D

[Bobbo]

Quick question for all you rat players out there. Do you try to move the rats all as one big happy group, or do you try to run them all in a line (always move to engage if possible)?

Example, I have 20 rats 12 spaces spaces away from 8 4th Mass line on a perfectly flat map. I move in and the 4th Mass start blasting. Is it better to try to move additional rats up to bolster the 6 space away group, or run 2 of the 4 (possibly 3 after the attack) up to engage?

Then in the follow up activation, do you move 4 more rats up, or attack with the ones you have?

(I realize that a lot of these answers are reliant on other figures in play and stuff like that. I'm just trying to get an overall feel for how they are played.)

[toddrew]

Quick question for all you rat players out there. Do you try to move the rats all as one big happy group, or do you try to run them all in a line (always move to engage if possible)?

Example, I have 20 rats 12 spaces spaces away from 8 4th Mass line on a perfectly flat map. I move in and the 4th Mass start blasting. Is it better to try to move additional rats up to bolster the 6 space away group, or run 2 of the 4 (possibly 3 after the attack) up to engage?

Then in the follow up activation, do you move 4 more rats up, or attack with the ones you have?

(I realize that a lot of these answers are reliant on other figures in play and stuff like that. I'm just trying to get an overall feel for how they are played.)

Like you said, depends on the board and what you've got behind the rats. The general strategy is to engage the ranged enemy figures with the rats and then move your ranged figures into range to blast the enemy. Or surround your fragile ranged figures with the rats and then engage the enemy melee figures as they approach, then blast with range.

What you're hoping for with the rats is that they can engage and survive a few attacks in order to move the other rats up behind them without using any further order markers on them, instead using those on attacks from your other figures.

[DoesntCompute]

Quick question for all you rat players out there. Do you try to move the rats all as one big happy group, or do you try to run them all in a line (always move to engage if possible)?

Example, I have 20 rats 12 spaces spaces away from 8 4th Mass line on a perfectly flat map. I move in and the 4th Mass start blasting. Is it better to try to move additional rats up to bolster the 6 space away group, or run 2 of the 4 (possibly 3 after the attack) up to engage?

Then in the follow up activation, do you move 4 more rats up, or attack with the ones you have?

(I realize that a lot of these answers are reliant on other figures in play and stuff like that. I'm just trying to get an overall feel for how they are played.)

Like you said, depends on the board and what you've got behind the rats. The general strategy is to engage the ranged enemy figures with the rats and then move your ranged figures into range to blast the enemy. Or surround your fragile ranged figures with the rats and then engage the enemy melee figures as they approach, then blast with range.

What you're hoping for with the rats is that they can engage and survive a few attacks in order to move the other rats up behind them without using any further order markers on them, instead using those on attacks from your other figures.

What he said. It depends on the situation but in the scenario you described, I would move 4 rats 6 spaces and then have all 4 rats attack each other. I would use the extra movement to engage as many 4th Mass as possible (each rat will have moved 14). I would close the 12 space gap with the initial 4 rats and then depend on my opponent attempting to kill the rats next to them to bring in reinforcements. I could repeat the process on my next turn to tie up more 4th Mass. if needed.