The Rap vs. Techno Debate

[tyguy94920]

One thing I have never understood about music is the entire rap genre. And most people that like rap are really into it and don't listen to anything else

But what most "Rappers" hate most is Techno

I cannot comprehend this thinking. When you strip all the lyrics from any rap song it instantly becomes their most hated thing in the world Techno

As some one who digs anything over 120bpm with a moving line (check out below).

Who agrees, disagrees, or just plain has another opinion?



Sample of my playlist (116 songs) of pretty much all I listen too

Amerika- Rammstein
Baba O'Riley - The Who
Celebration - Cool and the Gang
Don't Fear the Reaper - Blue Oyster Cult
Green Onions - Brooker T and the MGs
Hot N Cold - Katie Perry
I Can't Turn You Loose - The Blues Brothers Theme
The Imperial March
More Than a Feeling - Boston
Right Round - Flo Ritta
Roundabout - Yes
Yackety Sax - Boots Randolph
Yeah - Usher

[jschild]

Because the music is the least important thing in rap. The heart and soul of rap is the spoken word. Stripping that away is like ripping the essence of the song away.

Rap is not about the "music" much (except for holding a good beat). Much like country music, the heart is in the story and feelings from the words and not the music.

[Melwing17]

If the story and feelings from the words is "Move b*tch, get out the way, get out the way b*tch", then I don't want any part of it.

[J4Jandar]

If the story and feelings from the words is "Move b*tch, get out the way, get out the way b*tch", then I don't want any part of it.

Seriously, One cannot spell Crap without rap. Nigga, Nigga, b*tch, motha F-a, ho, for shizzle. :x Oh yeah, ... and a wickity, wickity, scratch! :p ;)

[RabSheila]

Sample of my playlist (116 songs) of pretty much all I listen too

Celebration - Kool and the Gang
Right Round - Flo Rida


Couple of corrections. You don't want Flo or Kool getting ticked off if they happen to be scoping out the scape site and see their names misspelled.

[jschild]

Oh, I forgot every bit of rap was of that low quality.

It cannot compare to quality like "I wanna hold your hand" of course :P

[J4Jandar]

Oh, I forgot every bit of rap was of that low quality.

It cannot compare to quality like "I wanna hold your hand" of course :P
http://www.csun.edu/~vcpsy00h/images/wrhammer.gif:p

[tubafication]

I think that Rap is more of a thing that people listen to because they think it is cool, not because they like it. Don't get mad at me, I'm saying some people, not all. If The Killers are considered Techno, then I love Techno. But I think Techno is not considered cool like Rap is. This is from school age experience.

[jschild]

Lol.....

I guess that was the only reason people listened to rock 'n roll.
I guess that was the only reason people listened to country.

People listen to rap because they like it. There are posers of course, there always are. But just like all the people seeing and paying to see Transformers 2, people listen to rap. Different strokes for different folks and all that.

Listen to what you want.

[J4Jandar]

Lol.....

I guess that was the only reason people listened to rock 'n roll.
I guess that was the only reason people listened to country.

People listen to rap because they like it. There are posers of course, there always are. But just like all the people seeing and paying to see Transformers 2, people listen to rap. Different strokes for different folks and all that.

Listen to what you want.

True 'nuff though please tell me you are not this guy!

http://www.filmweb.no/bilder/multimedia/archive/00012/Malibus_Most_Wanted_12477c.jpg

[jschild]

Lol, no. I don't like Rap personally, though I understand it's cultural appeal. Same with country music.

Not liking a style of music does not equal it being bad nor does it mean you don't "get" it.

I don't care for the Beatles much either, but I "get" them.

[J4Jandar]

Lol, no. I don't like Rap personally, though I understand it's cultural appeal. Same with country music.

Not liking a style of music does not equal it being bad nor does it mean you don't "get" it.

I don't care for the Beatles much either, but I "get" them.

I definately understand it's culrural appeal though if it's not "your culture" then ya start to loose me.

[jschild]

You don't have to be of a "culture" to enjoy something from that culture.

[Agent Minivann]

As far as techno and rap, the way I look at it is that there are different "leads". What is the focal point of rap? The lyrics, probably more specifically the angst, the anger, or the story. What is the focal point of techno? The nearest I can figure is the beat. While the two genres might have some superficial similarities, the point of the music is completely different. As someone who favors a focus on instruments and music, I don't have much time for either.

You don't have to be of a "culture" to enjoy something from that culture.
I just wish that said person would stop trying to become part of that culture when it is painfully obvious that they are not.

[jschild]

Whose right is it to judge who is, or isn't, part of that culture. Culture is a completely artificial term for the most part anyway. I'm white but I'm not part of the "white" culture any more than I'm part of the "African-American" culture.

Just be who you are and what makes you happy. Trying to deny someone who enjoys another culture from enjoying it serves no purpose. Just don't be a poser to it.

[J4Jandar]

As far as techno and rap, the way I look at it is that there are different "leads". What is the focal point of rap? The lyrics, probably more specifically the angst, the anger, or the story. What is the focal point of techno? The nearest I can figure is the beat. While the two genres might have some superficial similarities, the point of the music is completely different. As someone who favors a focus on instruments and music, I don't have much time for either.

You don't have to be of a "culture" to enjoy something from that culture.
I just wish that said person would stop trying to become part of that culture when it is painfully obvious that they are not.
Word yo...

VBulletin: You have given out too much Reputation in the last 24 hours, try again later.

[J4Jandar]

Whose right is it to judge who is, or isn't, part of that culture. Culture is a completely artificial term for the most part anyway. I'm white but I'm not part of the "white" culture any more than I'm part of the "African-American" culture.

Just be who you are and what makes you happy. Trying to deny someone who enjoys another culture from enjoying it serves no purpose. Just don't be a poser to it.

I think the people of that culture have made perfectly clear the "Whiggers" (please excuse the terminology) are NOT part of their culture.

Example number one:

http://images.starpulse.com/pictures/2008/10/05/previews/Vanilla%20Ice-RKY-000434.jpg (http://www.starpulse.com/Music/Vanilla_Ice/gallery/SGG-039061/)

[jschild]

Again, there is a difference between someone who at the height of his "popularity" was a poser, and someone like Eminem who is considered part of the culture.

[J4Jandar]

Again, there is a difference between someone who at the height of his "popularity" was a poser, and someone like Eminem who is considered part of the culture.

He is still a poser to me. Once we get some of the culture in question to validate your claims he is "in da club" then you may convince me. Then again, you also may not. :p

[jschild]

Lol, if you think Eminem is a poser, you are way off base. He is one of the most respected voices in the rap community.

[J4Jandar]

Lol, if you think Eminem is a poser, you are way off base. He is one of the most respected voices in the rap community.
Respected, not so sure about that one but even if he is he is the exception to the rule, the exception to the rule is not the rule. If a lot more cultures were envolved and respected in the rap community then I would be convinced.

Eminem is a poser, period. No one is gonna shoot this guy in a drive by because they don't like making little girls cry.

:shock: You just made me rap you jerk! I see what you're doing. :lol:

[tyguy94920]

That wasn't exactly how I expected the thread to go.....

But were talking about rap so I guess it can't be helped




I wanted a music based thread, not a culture based

[jschild]

We did talk about rap. The reason is that they have nothing to do with each other. One is all about the music, the other is all about the lyrics. There is some crossover as there is in all things, but as a general rule, that's the difference.

[J4Jandar]

We did talk about rap. The reason is that they have nothing to do with each other. One is all about the music, the other is all about the lyrics. There is some crossover as there is in all things, but as a general rule, that's the difference.

Exactly, and if you wanna interject something then do so before we follow our own path. ;)

Just goes to show you even less people care about techno. :p

[nyys]

I'm a pretty big techo fan, I was hoping this thread would lead to some good stuff for the gym (links please).

[J4Jandar]

I'm a pretty big techo fan, I was hoping this thread would lead to some good stuff for the gym (links please).
I stand corrected. :roll: :p

[nyys]

I'm a pretty big techo fan, I was hoping this thread would lead to some good stuff for the gym (links please).
I stand corrected. :roll: :p

My current mix has gone stale, I've switched back to Metal for the time being (specifically 3 Inches of Blood (http://www.3inchesofblood.com/)).

[J4Jandar]

I'm a pretty big techo fan, I was hoping this thread would lead to some good stuff for the gym (links please).
I stand corrected. :roll: :p

My current mix has gone stale, I've switched back to Metal for the time being (specifically 3 Inches of Blood (http://www.3inchesofblood.com/)).

GOATRIDERS! Too awesome. :lol:

[tyguy94920]

I'm a pretty big techo fan, I was hoping this thread would lead to some good stuff for the gym (links please).

My techno mix for you, not too much but some good stuff (hopefully)

- Some of it's from the disco era too, sorry

Another One Bites the Dust - Queen
Brick House - The Commodors
Can't Touch This - M.C. Hammer
Celebration - Kool & the Gang
Cha Cha Slide -
Cotton Eye Joe - Rednex
Feel Good Inc. - Gorrilaz
I Can't Turn You Loose - Blues Brothers
In A Gadda Da Vidda (Short Version) - Iron Butterfly
Hot N Cold - Katie Perry
It's All About the Petiums - Weird Al
Last Dance With Mary Jane - Tom Petty
Livin On A Prayer - Bon Jovi
Love Shack - B-52s
Low Rider - War
Orange Crush - R.E.M.
Safety Dance - Men at Work
Soul Man -
Sweet Dreams (are made of these) - Eurythmics
Viva la Vida - Coldplay
You Dropped a Bomb On Me - The Gap Band



Yeah.... I'm a geek

[Rew]

tyguy94920, I "hear" what you are saying in your original post thought I think the list of tracks you just posted above are almost nothing I would call Techno. I think your feelings on Rap hating Techno are because it is purely a defense, on the part of Rap music, to try and elevate and propagate that specific music. You are absolutely right in that the musical underpinnings of Rap/HipHop are very amorphous, genre bending, and inclusive (I highly doubt the Black Eyed Peas "hate" techno). Sampling and remixing was brought to the forefront by both "dance" and "rap" but I currently argue the empire is now ruled by the all inclusive "electronic" and all the flavors of its sub-genres.

Electronic safely encompasses Techno into its fold completely and any Rap/Hip-hop that uses any electronic sounding backing or enough distortion is enveloped too. Rap that leans more to R&B, soul, or others remains somewhat immune. Welcome to the BLOB! Electronic will consume all!

I looked through some of the tracks I've recently added to my iTunes library over the past 200 days and tried to bring up some of the closest electronic music that I could pin as a blend of Techno/Rap ...

Hacksaw - Ooah (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FERepsWH4R8&)

Make it Hott - Uffie vs. CrystalCastles (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ye2F4ixPTjI)

... these two, I think, are very "pure" interpretations of what most consider Rap and Techno smashed together. As soon as you add any modern electronic music, I won't fight anyone labeling it one thing or another, but it is so subjective that you can label it practically anything it harkens to.

Rap and Tehcno, both in their purest forms, hold little interest for me these days. Not because I'm a pretentious hipster elitist musical snob, just more because all the things that fall safely under the umbrella of "electronic", are so much more varied, wonderful, and new.

I think both Rap and Techno are "inclusive" in their nature even despite those who try and fiercely defend their genre turf by decrees of this is rap/techno and this is not. To both the musical styles credit I think thier musical inclusiveness is one of their major strengths. Like languages though, I feel that those styles which fail to continue to evolve, and entrench and try and strictly define what they are, will die and cease to be relevant.

Not surprisingly, this must by why I like modern electronic movement so much. When musical styles push their boundaries and shift out of thier foundation enough they tend to wind up in the "I have no clue what to call that anymore, let's call it electronic" genre. ("Oh wait, that was made by an independent label ... ok sorry ... it's now "indie". :-P )

The 'sub genre' for Ooah is "GlitchHop" ... whatever. There is a huge collaboration of artists under the "GlitchMob (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jztRZ34AEcY)" label that are just one of the closest things to hip-hop/rap without words that I've found.

Do I like rap? Some of it I actually do. Especially the stuff that is culturally relevant to me (the song posted at the end of this post, the Beastie Boys, CocoRosie (could be rap), and a very outrageously filthy/bad group called Avenue D)

Do I like Techno? I struggle with this more than the Rap question. This mostly has to do with the fact that, for me, the definition of Tehcno is more like acid/triphop repeated same thump thump thump a thon music. A style that a lot of people could call Techno, I suppose, or the Sub-genre of electro' that I probably like the most is called IDM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqssdvi8UxE) (intelligent dance music). It's best described as dance music for your ears.

Tastes great. Less filling. If you want to explore some interesting music out there I highly recommend things like Pandora as well as iLike. (link to my iLike profile (http://ilike.com/user/AgentRew))

Call it what you will, as long as it is goooooood. :)

And as a tribute to the moderators and the forums I leave with this outtro ....

Obey the Moderator - Optimus Rhyme (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTLwiccIOxI)

[Rew]

Quick Metal detour ...

Nyys, that's (http://www.3inchesofblood.com/) some pretty serious speed/thrash metal! I haven't listened to that in awhile. I think to some degree I won't grow much past a classic metal base. I find I only sparingly listen to it as "angry background music" when I do some "serious" computer gaming. :)

A couple metal related groups I'm exploring are "Mastodon" and "Isis". Much less fierce than speed metal but good. Yet to purchase anything.

[nyys]

Brick House - The Commodors
Can't Touch This - M.C. Hammer
Celebration - Kool & the Gang
Cha Cha Slide -
Cotton Eye Joe - Rednex
Feel Good Inc. - Gorrilaz
I Can't Turn You Loose - Blues Brothers
In A Gadda Da Vidda (Short Version) - Iron Butterfly
Hot N Cold - Katie Perry
It's All About the Petiums - Weird Al
Last Dance With Mary Jane - Tom Petty
Livin On A Prayer - Bon Jovi
Love Shack - B-52s
Low Rider - War
Orange Crush - R.E.M.
Safety Dance - Men at Work
Soul Man -
Sweet Dreams (are made of these) - Eurythmics
Viva la Vida - Coldplay

Nice list tyguy, and you've been permanently put on my 'You Rock!' list for having the Safety Dance in there, my all time favorite 80s song. I've had many of the songs on your list in my mix at some point, but compared to what I'm used too I wouldn't call too much of this techno.

I'll post a list of some of the stuff I've downloaded recently (have to wait until I get home though).

Quick Metal detour ...

Nyys, that's (http://www.3inchesofblood.com/) some pretty serious speed/thrash metal! I haven't listened to that in awhile. I think to some degree I won't grow much past a classic metal base. I find I only sparingly listen to it as "angry background music" when I do some "serious" computer gaming. :)

3 Inches of Blood definitely falls into the categorie of plain ole screaming into the microphone with insane riffs being played behind it. Not something I can listen too at home to relax, but it's perfect for getting hyped up at the gym and make myself push a little harder down the stretch.

Techo does this for me as well, nothing like a crazy beat to make you run a little faster to try and keep up with the music.

[Nikmis]

I like chiptunes

http://www.biglionmusic.com/category/chiptunes

[Rew]

I like chiptunes

http://www.biglionmusic.com/category/chiptunes

I'm a fan of "8-bit" inspired music as well. Sometimes nothing compares to the real deal. I bought the Konami Castle Vania soundtrack recently. So much fun.

Nikmis, you should check out a group called Copy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXG9dB9zXlA). Very great stuff.

Or, if you cram an 80s rock cassette into an Atari you can get this, by Ratatat (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1H7vZYBeHc)

(Ok, one more (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onajP5k5cm8) by Copy, this one at the 1:20 mark just starts to blow me away)

[Ugly-Caco]

Rap shouldn't be a genre. Hiphop is. Rap can be in Rock/numetal/country/gospel or even on a national anthem (maybe).

To hell with pop/subcultures. Don't grow a philosophy on those things except if you're a comedian.

[Einar Gen.]

I prefer rap when it's mixed with good rock. Linkin Park comes to mind... Techno, also, is much improved when combined with rock... Possibly because both of them are sort of like stripped down rock.

[Ugly-Caco]

-browser malfunction-

[Ugly-Caco]

I'm a fan of "8-bit" inspired music as well. Sometimes nothing compares to the real deal. I bought the Konami Castle Vania soundtrack recently. So much fun.
Hey my favorite 8-bit artist is Bitshifter! He's the dude with the Gameboys when he does a live set.
http://receptorsmusic.com/8BitOps-Bit_Shifter_by_Jonas_Lund.JPG

[Uprising]

I think that Rap is more of a thing that people listen to because they think it is cool, not because they like it.

That's totally true. When I pull out my extensive Wu-Tang Clan collection of CDs, I feel cooler. I actually hate the music and think it sucks, but damn.......I sure am cool for listening to it.

/sarcasm :?

[Anonymous]

"Music is like candy, you keep the good stuff and throw away the rappers."

Sorry, I couldn't resist.:lol:

[Ugly-Caco]

I think that Rap is more of a thing that people listen to because they think it is cool, not because they like it.

That's totally true. When I pull out my extensive Wu-Tang Clan collection of CDs, I feel cooler. I actually hate the music and think it sucks, but damn.......I sure am cool for listening to it.

/sarcasm :?
Ok...you have a Wu-Tang Clan collection?

Rap is awesome. Same as rock and everything else. Also there are retarded aspects in each of them. No genre is perfect. Rasmus stinks.

[Uprising]

"Music is like candy, you keep the good stuff and throw away anything by country music artists, Michael Bolton, Barry Manilow, or Celine Dion."

Sorry, I couldn't resist.:lol:

Fixed that for ya.


Ok...you have a Wu-Tang Clan collection?

Every album. Love the Wu.8)

[tyguy94920]

Nice list tyguy, and you've been permanently put on my 'You Rock!' list for having the Safety Dance in there, my all time favorite 80s song. I've had many of the songs on your list in my mix at some point, but compared to what I'm used too I wouldn't call too much of this techno.

I think the list of tracks you just posted above are almost nothing I would call Techno

I'd say I'd just about qualify about half of that Techno, and the rest just have a really good beat. I added two songs that I forgot, and I'll go back and bold what I consider Techno.

[Ugly-Caco]

Ok...you have a Wu-Tang Clan collection?

Every album. Love the Wu.8)
Wanted to make sure before I give you a rep. Hahaha!

[scorpiusx]

I guess that I'm a very rare individual: I'll listen to close to anything.

I'm fifteen years old, and was raised on country and gospel music, with the occasional folk music like Cat Stevens thrown in there. Somewhere in the middle there, I started being exposed to more classic rock/70's and 80's metal. Now, in just the past year or two, I've listened to heavy doses of R&B and Hip Hop. I've listened to dispersed Pop all of my life. My favorite artist is Ted Nugent, and I just finished a workout a while ago while listening to Lil Wayne and Evanescence on my MP3 Player. Yeah, figure that one out.

Truth be told, I like it all about equally. The thing is this: you have to train yourself to listen to it. I listen to rap for its beat and swagger, I can listen to Gospel for the message, I'll listen to Rock to place myself inside of the instrumentals, I'll listen to Country for a feeling of nostalgia...the list goes on and on. Really, a cultural diversity is pretty cool. I'll admit, I used to hate rap-until started listening to it.

The only things that I'm not fond of (other than the Jonas Brothers, of course) is Techno and Death Metal. However, I'm sure that this is merely due to the fact that I very rarely listen to these genres, and, after enough exposure, would likewise probably become accustomed to the sounds.

Just my :2cents:

-scorp

[Rew]

Hiphopopotamus vs. Rhymenoceros (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FArZxLj6DLk).

Word.

Keep the battle going , keep the beats steady.
Someone on the forums has got to be ready.

So ... hit-hit, hit rap back.
I say ... hit-hit, hit rap back.

It's time to post a hard hittin' techno track.


DJ Rew
(whitest rapper eva')

[Khenemutankh]

As someone involved in the industry, I feel the need to interject my own view point.

Going to the original post, I'd like to address the differences of Rap vs. Techno.

First off, Techno instrumentals are usually synth driven, at a higher BPM, and have more changes throughout the instrumental track.

Rap instrumentals are typically pretty fast as well, but have a wider range of speeds. Alot of rap instrumentals are more based around classical instruments than are techno instrumentals. Piano, violins, cellos, flutes, etc... are more widely used in rap instrumentals than in techno.

The problem is, at the heart of it, it's all the same. IF you take a techno instrumental and slow it down to 95-100 BPM and rap over it, you've got a rap instrumental. The same for any synth-driven hip hop instrumental, if you speed it up, it becomes techno.

In this day and age of genre-bending, it's hard to really say what sets apart certain genres anymore. Rap is becoming techno-pop, and pop is becoming euro-trance. Behind the scenes you still have the core groups: The guys who are underground hip hop heads and embrace the sampled beats and lyric-centric songs.

(Disclaimer: I am not as knowledgeable on techno as I am when it comes to hip hop, so if anything I've stated here is untrue please feel free to correct me.)

As a huge fan of rap, as well as someone who makes their living off of writing it, I don't see why liking one genre should inherently make you dislike another. Being involved in the music in the capacity of production as well, I embrace all forms of music, as each has its own merits and nuances that can help you enhance your own work.

Techno is great for dancing. Hip hop is too. Techno is often bass-heavy with a strong synth element. Hip hop is too. Really, they're not that different musically. It's all about the vocals.

Sorry if I repeated anything that was already in this thread.

-Khen.

[Rew]

Rap + Techno + J-Pop (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oz4rlVasd6o)

I like some of Capsule's more bubble gum (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldoTRaIQBiQ) stuff a bit better, but this track grew on me, and thought it belonged linked in this thread. And if that has you feeling <3ing towards Japan send a love letter (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JliA3Lo1NA).

[Ugly-Caco]

Are you talking about Mad Capsule Market? Japanese techno punk band (can't click your link...I'm at work hehe).